Posted on 05/05/2022 9:13:35 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
Yup me either. They are harder to spot than big feet lol
The F22 is the most advance, most effective aircraft in the arsenal. It is a true Gen5 aircraft. They want to keep the joint strike fighter instead?
Makes zero sense. Hell, give it to the Navy. The Air Force. What a joke. A military branch in search of a mission. There’s some savings available right there.
Next time....
Ha!
“maybe I am totally off base, but I cannot believe this aircraft, which was touted to be such a great addition to the Air Force’s inventory, is now eventually headed to the boneyard....”
You’re not off base, because to me it feels like about two or three months ago I was in my thirties and that was a solid 35 years ago... so yeah I can’t believe it’s that old... but it is.
As a bonus it will weaken the US military.
—————
Bingo! I am glad to see people waking up. The Neocans, the Ukie war cheerleaders, the pro abortionists, the “poor poor immigrants” ilk, the diversity cheerleaders, the BLM supporters, etc… all need to wake and ask first- how does this/ that build up America?
The very FIRST question must be based on the realization that ANYTHING vegetable Head and his administration is to harm American as we have known it….there is nothing pure and righteous about Biden and his policies, nothing.
To support ANYTHING ( the Ukie war, men in woman’s bathrooms, men playing in woman’s sports, Transqftg “ rights”, gay marriage, diversity over qualifications, vax mandates, etc) that Biden supports is evil, and those supporting just one item of his agenda are supporting evil.
Wake up America! You have lost all sense of reasoning.
Not that there is any chance of that happening soon /s
... its combat radius of approximately 590 nautical miles (less with any use of supercruise) is not ideal for a war with China. This is because jets may need to be flying from locations like Guam ...
which will be a glowing hole in the ocean as Rocket Man likely has orders to nuke it from NK as part of the opening salvo against Taiwan. Then we'll have to decide whether to nuke China or simply resolve the Korean War once and for all.
Being very old, I’m still pissed about shutting down the P-47, Gruman Hellcat, P-38 Lightning, Liberator, B-17, and B-29...☹
I wonder if the one F-117 that was shot down was part of the reason to remove it from inventory.
I wonder if the one F-117 that was shot down was part of the reason to remove it from inventory.
“In WWII, we had the most advanced fighter (the P51 Mustang). ...” [PGR88, post 36]
Your analysis doesn’t go far enough.
The P-47 was rated superior to the P-51 in most analyses of warplane effectiveness, and in many individual pilot reports.
It was produced in slightly larger numbers (15,636 vs 15,469).
It carried twice the gun armament compared to initial P-51 variants (8x50 cal guns compared to 4x50 cal guns in P51B and C; only the D model and higher carried 6x50 cal guns). It also held twice the ammunition (3400 rounds vs 1840).
It lifted twice the bomb load or more (2,500 pounds vs 1,000 pounds). Each machine could carry 10x5-inch rockets.
The P-47 attained greater speed at altitude and could maneuver better (instantaneous turn rate).
Only in range could the P-51D and later models outdo the P-47 (1660 miles vs 1030 miles). When fully fueled, P-51s were dangerously unstable, demanding very delicate, judicious handling even from the most seasoned pilots. Partly explains the P-51 loss rate: more were lost to landing and takeoff mishaps than to hostile action.
Hermann Georing said after the war: “When I saw P51’s over Berlin, I knew the jig was up.”
In 1990, I was living in Corpus Christi, TX. The Navel Air Station there had a small scale open house and air show of sorts so we went to it. Fun day for sure! The Confederate Air Force flew a few planes in from their Harlingen base of operation. Included were a P-51 Mustang and a F-4U Corsair. Completely opposite planes.
We were standing along the taxiway where the turn in to the runway was. Both planes taxied by together then took off a few moments apart. The Mustang smooth and elegant, a thoroughbred and the Corsair a hulking, fire breathing monster. No clue which one would have been the “better” fighter.
Hands down though, the Corsair was best at ground support, which kept it in production into the 1950s for awhile and in active foreign AF service around the world through something like mid-80s or so, perhaps a little longer. I think the USAF retired the F-4U a year or two after Korea and the AF reserve retired theirs towards the late 50s.
“I wonder if the one F-117 that was shot down was part of the reason to remove it from inventory.” [NY Attitude, post 49]
Coincidental.
The only loss of an F-117 to hostile fire happened because the pilot flew into a barrage of missiles that weren’t being guided at all...radars were unable maintain track on the aircraft. The groundhogs kept lobbing missiles into the general area until flaming bits of airframe rained down.
The F-117 - not a “fighter” (air-to-air combat craft) at all but a bomb-dropping platform - was more of a semi-experimental proof-of-concept machine than a viable combat platform. The simplest mathematical formulations (in radar terms; similar with other signatures) were used in designing its shapes and surface qualities. Once the aircraft proven the aeronautical (and operational) viability of low-observables engineering, it had served its purpose; otherwise, it was quite marginal in terms of basic performance and warload - no better than the F-100 in range and weapon hauling.
From this basic start, more advanced math was formulated and then used to design the B-2, and subsequent small aircraft.
The NGAD is the Next Generation Air Dominance program.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGOtjcv7dT8&ab_channel=Sandboxx
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_Generation_Air_Dominance
The US Air Force has built and flown a mysterious full-scale prototype of its future fighter jet
https://www.defensenews.com/breaking-news/2020/09/15/the-us-air-force-has-built-and-flown-a-mysterious-full-scale-prototype-of-its-future-fighter-jet/
Next-Generation Air Dominance Platform (NGAD) Expected to Fly with Unmanned Drones
https://warriormaven.com/air/next-generation-air-dominance-platform-ngad-6th-generation-stealth-fighter
My guess is the U.S. Air Force is about to announce the world's first "Sixth Generation Fighter".
My hope is there will be an export version for Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and the United Kingdom; as well as a version for Israel and Japan.
I do not believe that the F-35 has a better combat radius than the F-22.
I do believe that the USAF learned a lot about computer architecture during development of the F-35.
The F-35 architecture allows nations, such as Israel and the UK, to integrate their own weapons and threat management systems into their aircraft. This is done without access to the source code of the mission computer(s).
Thank you for your response.
“...I think the USAF retired the F-4U a year or two after Korea and the AF reserve retired theirs towards the late 50s.”
USAF never operated the Corsair (F4U made by Vought; FG made by Goodyear). In US military service, it was solely a USN and USMC system.
Corsairs were important in support of ground forces early in Korean War, but suffered significant losses when the Communist forces started using Soviet jet fighters.
USAF used late model P-51s in supporting ground forces, but they also suffered serious loss, often to ground fire. The aircraft cooling system was located on the airframe underside.
Ground support was eclipsed for a time, until USAF brought in the B-26 (A-26 Invader built by Douglas in WW2) and Republic’s F-84 Thunderjet; USN brought in its Skyraider attack aircraft. Jets (F-80, F-86) were sent in to counter Communist MiGs. Better air/ground communication, coordination and protcols were developed.
“A-10’s don’t fly at 35,000ft.”
I know, and the Air Force brass wanted to get rid of them.
“...the F-35 cannot hope to fill the role of air superiority regardless of range...” [doorgunner69, post 4]
“The Air Force top brass are a bunch of bean counters that believe they can build and operate one aircraft that can meet the mission requirements of multiple roles...” [taxcontrol, post 5]
“...Current/modern air superiority is all about AAM range and detection/targeting range. It will not be another decade before that is done with transport sized aircraft. Already they are being tested as “missile trucks”...” [Mariner, post 11]
“...And the F-35 will magically deliver as:...light bomber... ground attack...combat fighter...close...air support...anti-satellite...anti-submarine...Pizza delivery platform...” [MercyFlush, post 12]
“...And provide ground support from 35000 feet.” [dljordan, post 35]
The F-35 will do fine in air-to-air roles, if air-to-air weapons are mounted. Missiles have completely outclassed manned craft since the mid 1980s, but the fighter mafia cannot bear to admit it.
USAF’s top brass are fighter pilots. Not as smart as bean-counters - whom they usually ignore as it is.
Extra kudos to Mariner for pointing out key factors in modern air combat. Most other respondents cannot bear to admit that dogfighting (hard-turning, visual only, guns only) was on its way out by the mid 1930s. As WW2 began, the modern fighter had advance so greatly in performance that any pilot was helpless without direction and support from ground-based sensor and command/control networks.
Air-to-air weapons have been proposed since the 1950s, to arm larger aircraft. Look up Project Pye Wacket. The fighter mafia keeps killing them.
Despite cutesy sarcasm, MercyFlush has managed to leave two chief capabilities of the F-35 off the list:
(1) multi-platform networking, in which any aircraft (or similarly equipped platform, ground/air/water/space) can assume central control and redirect the attack force to any target that can be located. In real time.
(2) all-aspect situational awareness, including under and behind the aircraft. Traditional blind spots are disappearing.
All the capabilities are attainable, but it won’t be cheap. It’s not magic; good engineering development and operational testing are essential and cannot be rushed.
B-52Gs provided usefully accurate close air support from above 45,000 ft during DESERT STORM. It’s not been necessary to get inside eyeball range and hasn’t been for decades.
Stop living in the past.
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