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The Great Civil War Lie
NY Times Disunion ^
| June 5, 2013
| MARC-WILLIAM PALEN
Posted on 06/11/2013 4:48:08 AM PDT by iowamark
click here to read article
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To: iowamark
You mean, the liberal media lied about that too?
61
posted on
06/11/2013 1:15:35 PM PDT
by
Lee'sGhost
(Johnny Rico picked the wrong girl!)
To: Mouton
"We must, indeed, all hang together, or most assuredly we shall all hang separately." - B. Franklin
What you said upstream was "If it were not for the southern colonies during the Revolution, there would have been no United States" which, besides being sorta self-serving, is only partially true. The truth is that all the colonies needed each other if we were to survive.
The issue it underlayed was monetary driven by tariffs.
Not true
That and the fact few people actually owned slaves in the south and Lee and a good number of his generals also did not or had freed them prior to the war. None of this is mythology, it is historic fact.
Not true
62
posted on
06/11/2013 1:20:52 PM PDT
by
rockrr
(Everything is different now...)
To: rockrr
“That and the fact few people actually owned slaves in the south and Lee and a good number of his generals also did not or had freed them prior to the war. None of this is mythology, it is historic fact.
Not true”
Actually it is truer than blue. Interestingly, some Northern generals or their families were slave holders FWIW.
63
posted on
06/11/2013 1:41:10 PM PDT
by
Mouton
(108th MI Group.....68-71)
To: ClearCase_guy
I see it as spin. The US Republic was notorious in its early days in using tariffs to protect industries, which frankly only went to reward some (northern industry) at the expense of others (the South). Did we really need 650,000 dead to solve this issue though?
64
posted on
06/11/2013 1:51:48 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: Moose4
Reminds me of the saintification of FDR and the Democrats by official Jewry. Yet, FDR was a vocal anti-semite.
65
posted on
06/11/2013 1:52:57 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: Mouton
Exactly. The North already had an economic leg up on the south in that most industry was located there, so why did they need an added political gift of what amounted to subsidies, called tariffs?
66
posted on
06/11/2013 1:55:11 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: SampleMan
I agree. The whole basis for British involvement in WWII was to knock Germany down a peg. The British never did and never would endure a rival on the open seas.
67
posted on
06/11/2013 1:56:45 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: C19fan
Wow, I didn't know Toryism would come into this conversation. As a Canadian, Toryism is a real and constant threat. Vocal Tories make the preservation of tradition and authority a religion that causes them to hate everything American and everything Whig. That is why Herbert Spencer is a hero for me. You could say Toryism goes all the way back to the Cavaliers who supported the King and official state religion. Whigs would hail back to the Roundheads and the Republican ideals of Cromwell.
68
posted on
06/11/2013 2:00:02 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: Ditto; Mouton
The US did not have an excise taxes in 1835 or in 1860. Even the Whiskey tax was long gone.
And here I was thinking those Gamecocks or Palmettos were drinking up a storm.
No wonder old times there weren't forgotten (or remembered very clearly either).
I guess Mouton meant import taxes (tariffs).
Of course, the problem is that Southern exports were high but the tariffs were imposed on imports.
Because of all the activity and circulation of money in the national economy, it wasn't necessarily true that those who got the most money from exports actually paid the most in taxes on imports.
69
posted on
06/11/2013 2:01:44 PM PDT
by
x
To: Smokin' Joe
I agree, but then what role did the Republican abolitionists and Lincoln play? Were they useful idiots for the power brokers that wanted to game to continue to be played, or were they a part of the conspiracy?
70
posted on
06/11/2013 2:02:14 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: donmeaker
Yet Northerners were far more bigoted than Southerners. A Southerner would never have used the word “Nigger” for instance, which Northerners clumsily tossed around.
71
posted on
06/11/2013 2:03:34 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: Smokin' Joe
Which to me is the proof in the pudding that Federalists like Alexander Hamilton were wrong and the anti-federalists were right. The size and scope of the current US government is proof that the idea of a strong authoritative Executive was a bad idea.
72
posted on
06/11/2013 2:05:44 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: iowamark
>> Pro-Southern business interests and journalists fed the myth that the war was over trade, not slavery...
The Civil War was over slavery? Really?
73
posted on
06/11/2013 2:06:19 PM PDT
by
Gene Eric
(Don't be a statist!)
To: Sam Gamgee
Yet Northerners were far more bigoted than Southerners. A Southerner would never have used the word Nigger for instance, which Northerners clumsily tossed around. When you believe a race is fit for slavery and nothing else does it matter what you call them?
74
posted on
06/11/2013 2:08:23 PM PDT
by
0.E.O
To: 0.E.O
Touche. I am not willing to absolve the South for slavery, but I am not convinced of the angelic image that has been painted of Lincoln and the North either.
75
posted on
06/11/2013 2:10:21 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: Sam Gamgee; rockrr; Ditto
Yet Northerners were far more bigoted than Southerners. A Southerner would never have used the word Nigger for instance, which Northerners clumsily tossed around.
In 1860? Absurd. I don't know if current scruples about the word existed back then, but I'm pretty sure that plenty of Southerners "clumsily tossed the word around."
76
posted on
06/11/2013 2:19:19 PM PDT
by
x
To: x
Depends if you believe “Gone with the Wind” (the book) is truth or propaganda.
77
posted on
06/11/2013 3:05:04 PM PDT
by
Sam Gamgee
(May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - Patton)
To: 0.E.O; Mouton
Madison said that the logical conclusion of the claim that a state could leave without the consent of the other states is that the other states could expel a state without its consent. LOL! Really? You've still posting from the body of that (keep it under you hat) letter of Madison's without posting the beginning where it says:
A rightful secession requires the consent of the others, or an abuse of the compact absolving the seceding party from the obligation imposed by it.
James Madison to Alexander Rivas, Jan, 1833.
How totally disappointing. I'd thought better of you.
-------
>>Pardon my buttinskiness, Mouton, but this was posted to you, so...FReeper etiquette and all that. :-)
78
posted on
06/11/2013 4:03:42 PM PDT
by
MamaTexan
(The government was not instituted to define the Rights of the People)
To: Sam Gamgee
Touche. I am not willing to absolve the South for slavery, but I am not convinced of the angelic image that has been painted of Lincoln and the North either. Suffice it to say that the South was, at best, no different than the North in this regard?
79
posted on
06/11/2013 4:21:38 PM PDT
by
0.E.O
To: Sam Gamgee
You take the prize for the stupidest comment of the day. I learned that particular epithet while living in the south where it was indeed tossed about with reckless abandon.
Kudos
80
posted on
06/11/2013 4:23:43 PM PDT
by
rockrr
(Everything is different now...)
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