SURVEY SAYS...
Posted on 01/12/2009 11:24:22 AM PST by GreatOne
I look at the fact that Gaylord Perry and Phil Niekro both pitched for worse teams, and did much better.
It was like watching Grogan throw the long bomb on 3rd and 2 ... when Rice came to the plate with a man on first, you just knew what was going to happen.
If Bart Giamatti had not died I believe he would have reinstated Rose. I think a life sentence was too extreme.
I’m a lifelong Orioles fan (an older fan, so I remember when they were a classy organization), and I’m glad that Jim Rice is a hall of famer.
But let’s face it, one sportswriter did not vote for Cal Ripken to be in the hall. That’s way more absurd.
“Kids from the new millenium will have no idea what it meant to be a Red Sox fan. Bucky freakin’ Dent ... Stone Fingers I and II ... the interference call ... the list goes on.”
I was there for all of those years — I was at the game when Bucky hit it out, I was at Fenway for probably 30 games in 1975, when Rice and Lynn emerged.
Loved Yaz, but Lynn will always be my favorite Red Sox player. Nobody has ever had a rookie season like he did, and never will. He almost pulled them through game 7, to “seal the deal” on the greatest season ever. He ran into the wall in left center and nearly knocked himself out going for one of his signature catches, and he had homered earlier to put the Sox ahead.
The day he left the Sox was a crime.
I wouldn't have voted for him. He's a dbag and a cokehead. In my view, there is more than numbers to consider when judging HOF admission.
Career highlights and awards
17x All-Star selection (1965, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1973, 1974, 1975, 1976, 1977, 1978, 1979, 1980, 1981, 1982, 1985)
3x World Series champion (1975, 1976, 1980)
2x Gold Glove Award winner (1969, 1970)
Silver Slugger Award winner (1981)
1973 NL MVP
1963 NL Rookie of the Year
1975 World Series MVP
1976 Roberto Clemente Award
1969 Lou Gehrig Memorial Award
1968 Hutch Award
1975 Sports Illustrated Sportsman of the Year
Holds numerous other records and achievements
MLB Records
4,256 career hits
3,562 career games played
14,053 career at-bats
PET ROSE IS THE STANDARD BY WHICH ALL BASEBALL PLAYERS ARE MEASURED!
Bill James tells a story of sitting next to an octagenerian at Fenway one evening, talking to him about who the greatest player he ever saw was. He didn’t answer Yaz, or Teddy or even Smokey Joe Wood. He quickly responded “Fred Lynn. DOn’t think much of him now, but for a while there he was the best I ever saw.”
Why isn’t Tim Raines going in? Over 800 stolen bases, .385 career on base average. He was the second best leadoff hitter of his era after Henderson.
I agree with you on Lynn over Rice but, as a Yankees fan, I hated to see Rice come to the plate with the game on the line, especially when playing in Fenway! Rice had the advantage over Lynn of being a righty in Fenway and more than a couple of that 300 RBI difference in stats can be attributed to that factor alone. Lynn always struck me as more of a “team” guy too.
Henderson was a no brainer.
“It was like watching Grogan throw the long bomb on 3rd and 2 ... when Rice came to the plate with a man on first, you just knew what was going to happen.”
Statistically, what was going to happen was — a strike-out.
You’re not implying that his swing got BETTER with a man on, are you? Because — it notable got worse.
And Boggs — just cause we’re talking. If there was a man on third, with one out, and the Sox needed that run, and the pitcher grooved the first pitch down the middle, what would Boggs do? If you’re a Sox fan, you KNOW what he’d do — he would take that first pitch, watch it right into the catcher’s glove. And then he’d try to hit the ball on the ground for a single after that, rather than hit the sacrifice fly.
Because for Boggs, what mattered was his batting average, and thus what mattered was HIS ROUTINE -— not the team.
Now, Rice wasn’t in Bogg’s league in that department, but he couldn’t/didn’t have a way of digging deep to help the team. His swing never changes — he couldn’t/wouldn’t be situational in his approach.
More than that. He broke the one and only rule which is posted on every single clubhouse wall and has been since long before there was a union or collective bargining.
He probably is the loudest whiner of all-time, if you really need something to hang his hat on.
I’ll never forget seeing Rice check his swing, and his wrist strength was such that the bat snapped in his hands. I could not believe what I just witnessed - it seemed super-human.
maybe no one ever read it to him?
SURVEY SAYS...
It’s a travesty that 28 “sportswriters” did not vote for Rickey Henderson. They need to have their voting rights removed immediately. They probably cover east coast teams (like the Red Sux) and have no clue about players west of the Mississippi River
Ricky says that Ricky played for the Mets, the Yankees and the Red Sox.........Ricky says that Ricky played for teams both north and south of the Mississippi River....
With that “V” shape to him, he did have a HOF physique....
ROTFLMAO is you think Rose was a better ballplayer than Cobb. Cobb played in the dead-ball era when teams had no trainers and torn ligaments were treated with some tobacco juice and horse liniment. Yet Rose never came close to Cobb's averages. Rose played in 500+ more games and had 2500+ more at bats. Yet look at the batting average (+63 points for Cobb) and RBIs (+500 for Cobb).
The only real thing they had in common is that both were dirty players who would intentionally injure others and neither were the kind of people you would want you children to associate with.
And Cobb was not the greatest player in history. There are at least two ahead of him, IMHO.
| Ty Cobb |  |
Pete Rose |
|
|
|
|
| 3,034 | Games | 3,562 |
| 11,434 | AB | 14,053 |
| 4,190 | Hits | 4,256 |
| .366 | BA | .303 |
| 724 | 2B | 746 |
| 294 | 3B | 135 |
| 118 | HR | 160 |
| 1,933 | RBI | 1,314 |
| 2,245 | Runs | 2,165 |
I don't think so, and I grew up in Cincinnati idolizing Pete and the Big Red Machine.
The gambling on baseball is hands-down reason enough why he should never be in the HOF. However, what really gets me is that he not only proclaimed innocence for many years afterward; he did so while slandering the motives and actions of John Dowd (The Dowd Report) and other investigators and witnesses. He finally came mostly clean (while getting a book deal out of it), and his admission proved that Dowd and the others were telling the truth all along...
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