Ranch owner waives preliminary hearing in deaths of 32 bison

Associated Press ^ | September 12, 2008 | COLLEEN SLEVIN

[george76]

Hawn inflamed the situation by hiring illegal alien activists to slaughter his neighbor’s livestock.

[george76]

Mr. Hawn has 32 criminal charges against him... The property Mr. Hawn owns isn’t used as a ranch; it’s just a vacation area. In the first place, a rancher doesn’t hate animals and KILL them!

There isn’t any one that knows that the buffalo did any damage to anything; they’re just guessing.

It could have been a herd of elk that stays in that area; or even Hawn’s horses rubbing on his solar panels and TV dishes could have been the problem.

Vaughn Downare

http://www.theflume.com/main.asp?SectionID=2&SubSectionID=2&ArticleID=5474&TM=74279.37

[Renfield]

That’s a great story.

[Sarajevo]

It seems that no one respects the property rights of others. Hawn may be a punk, but the story states that he told the rancher to keep his bison under control, and later sued for the same reason.

I would have done the same thing. First time, you get a warning; second time, your animls disappear.

I wouldn't have wasted so much meat though.

[george76]

the bulk of the bison — 14 of them — were killed on land owned by Catherine Pimm.

Eight were killed on Bureau of Land Management property, four on U.S. Forest Service property, three on property of Robert Lemm and three on Hawn’s ranch.

[Shooter 2.5]

When you move into an area, you better know what the laws are. The law says if you don’t want bison on your property, you should put up a fence to keep those bison out or move back where you came from.

[B4Ranch]

The question is whether Buffalo are considered domesticated livestock or not. I would say no and you’re saying yes.

[B4Ranch]

The state law calls for three barbed wire fencing. Not 10 foot high steel posts with 1/2 inch cable fencing.

[B4Ranch]

>Eight were killed on Bureau of Land Management property, four on U.S. Forest Service property, three on property of Robert Lemm and three on Hawn’s ranch.<

Or is that where they wandered off to and died there?

Imagine the Indians killing them with bows and arroows. That must have been a sight.

[LeGrande]

Here. There’s the evidence. Colorado fence Law.

Lawful Fence C.R.S. § 35-46-101(1) defines a "lawful fence" as a "well-constructed three barbed wired fence with a substantial post set at a distance of approximately twenty feet apart, and sufficient to turn ordinary horses and cattle, with all gates equally as good as the fence..."

Obviously a three barbed wired fence won't stop a buffalo. A buffalo isn't an ordinary horse or cow. So if the homeowner had a three barbed wire fence then I would have to side with the homeowner.

Dogs? Well in this part of the country, you keep your dog at home. If your dog is found amongst my baby calves. The dog will die there. What dog? We did not see any dogs around here. He musta just gone up in the brush and died somewhere. I doubt you’ll ever see him again, big cat probably ate him.

Same here with buffalo : ) After about the second or third time someones buffalo comes through my fence (second time if they didn't immediately pay for damages the first time) I will have to buy an extra freezer or two and have big barbecue parties : )

I think the rancher is going to have a tough time proving that a buffalo is equivalent to a domesticated horse or cow.

[Concho]

Lets keep an eye on it and see how it plays out. Remember the dude is an outsider. The rancher is a home boy. The jury is the ranchers neighbors.

I am curious what the decisions will be.

[LeGrande]

I am curious what the decisions will be.

Me too. I'll ping you if I see how it plays out and I remember : )

My guess is that they are in trouble because they didn't shoot the buffalo while the buffalo were on his property. That is what gets people riled up. If that had been the case I doubt it would have even made the news, much less criminal charges.

[Concho]

The Colorado law does not distinguish by species. It applies to OWNED livestock. If the rancher OWNED the buffalo, then that is the end of the story. If the jury considers those buffalo as OWNED LIVESTOCK, then they are not wild and the law applies to them. Likewise, the dude is required to build a fence CAPABLE OF KEEPING THEM OUT. The buffalo were there before he was. Park County regulations make that clear.

The 3 wire fence is mentioned merely as a MINIMUM. If more is needed then he should build an adequate fence capable of holding them out. Three strands of barbed wire and 20 feet between posts is sure a MINIMUM FENCE. Any rancher will tell you that you dont space fence posts more than a rod apart (16.5 feet), and most fences where buffalo are held are at least 5 wires with wood posts every rod and steel posts half way in between. The dude will not win because the local people will not allow that sort of precedent to happen.

[B4Ranch]

> The dude will not win because the local people will not allow that sort of precedent to happen.<

I think you answered the true reason right there.

[redlegplanner]

by law (as I have researched, but if there is a laywer out there, feel free to correct me) if your neighbors livestock wanders onto your property you are entitled to corral it and charge him the cost of maintaining it until he retrieves it. You do not get to hirte a bunch of illegals to begin shooting it on your property and then chase it onto a thrid party’s and federal property killing as you chase, then leave the carcasses to rot.
BTW, Park county had record snowfall this winter with 25 foot snowdrifts. All kinds of critters were walking over the tops of all kinds of legal fences

[RJL]

if your neighbors livestock wanders onto your property you are entitled to corral it and charge him the cost of maintaining it until he retrieves it.

The complaints and damage claims were being completely ignored. As far as corralling the bison, see below.

======

Park county had record snowfall this winter with 25 foot snowdrifts. All kinds of critters were walking over the tops of all kinds of legal fences

The bison weren't walking over the neighbors fences on the snow, the bison were ripping the regular livestock fence apart, then continuing on their way destroying anything else they ran across.

As I said, shooting the bison was wrong, but the bison owner gets as much, or most, of the blame in my mind.

[Concho]

As it should be.

[B4Ranch]

I’m not quite sure I agree with it. If I bought the property next to yours and had no livestock for five years. Then I purchase 20 buffalo. Would you consider me rude for expecting you to fence out my livestock? Or should I fence in my livestock?

[B4Ranch]

Have you ever owned or worked with cattle? How about adult bulls? Have you ever seen one walk through a five wire fence in pursuit of a cow? The bull isn't hindered by the fence in the slightest way. He'll pop those wires and posts as if they were made out of Styrofoam. Seriously, that's what happens.

Buffalo, as humongous as they appear to be are just the opposite. They hop six foot fences as easy as a cat does.

[School of Rational Thought]

Get off the lawn before I call a cop!

Bison leaving footprints is a serious problem. Some make crank calls and knock on the door and run.

No wonder Hawn felt he needed protection.

Hawn qas exasperated, “We didn’t move way out here to have animals around”! “Don’t get me started about those eagles”