Confederate flags on space station draw ire

MSNBC ^ | 6/13/06 | James Oberg

[P-40]

I guess you never heard of The CSS Alabama.

One of the finest contributions England made to the Confederacy

Some Pictures:

http://www.lib.ua.edu/libraries/hoole/digital/cssala/intro.htm

http://www.history.navy.mil/branches/org12-1.htm

[P-40]

Ouch!

[P-40]

The War would have been avoided had the South chosen to industrialize

With an economy based largely on agribusiness and lacking the easy access to vast quantities of fresh water....I doubt they could have. This is true today for the most part.

Perhaps if the South had been paid up front for what amounted to a loss of property....who knows.

[orionblamblam]

> Pull out a map and see which army invaded which lands. Then tell us who is the aggressor.

The South attacked Fort Sumter, which was a US Federal military establishment. So, like Japan, which attacked Pearl Harbor and the Aleutians but did little else in the way of "invading" the US, the South launched an aggressive war.

[P-40]

The Klan marched under the American flag for over 100 years.

I bet their feet hurt! :)

[Non-Sequitur]

Exactly how many slave-bearing ships flew the Confederate battle flag upon their jackstaffs? None.

Such a blanket claim is impossible to support. Hundreds of blockade runners flew the confederate flag during the war, making trips to and from Cuba. It's likely that some slaves made the trip back into the confederacy.

And there's this. The most recent issue of "North and South" magazine has an article on confederate privateers. In the article they mention two instances where Northern ships were seized and all the crew removed except for a single black member, the intent being to take the ship back to confederate ports and sell the black man into slavery thus increasing the financial return. The only reason these two examples are mentioned is because in both cases the black crewman overpowered or killed some or all of the confederate prize crew and returned the ship to Northern waters. It is impossible to believe that these were the only cases, so no doubt some prizes, flying confederate flags, took slaves back into the confederacy.

Finally it is well documented that during both the 1862 and 1863 campaigns in the North, the confederate army seized free blacks and took them south to slavery. So unless you want to make a distiction between sailing under the confederate flag or marching under it I fail to see the difference.

[P-40]

I wonder why no one else has responded to your very informitive post?

It was responded to. It was crap also. Then his mother called him to bed.

[orionblamblam]

> I wonder why no one else has responded to your very informitive post?

Because the words of the Confederacy confound the claims of those who today see the war as "not about slavery." The state constitutions and declaratiosn nof seccession of the time make it quite clear *why* they secceded.. not because their problem was tarrifs of tax policy, but because they wanted to remain slave-states.

[Non-Sequitur]

It never fails, slavery is always pointed to as strictly a southern issue when in fact the institution was prevalent and legal in all of America at various times.

Ah but only the southern states were willing to launch a bloody rebellion to defend it. The Northern states ended if peacefully.

[orionblamblam]

> Like I thought. Another teenager

Nope. Not owning any slaves, I have to hold down a job, and getting to bed at a reasonable hour is often required to be able to accomplish that. Perhaps you should look into that novel concept.

[orionblamblam]

> the State of Alabama is opposed to reopening the African Slave Trade.

Yes... because they already had quite enough slaves, and didn't need to import more. This was a cost-free political move to make themselves more palatable to the likes of Great Britain.

[P-40]

Not owning any slaves

No one has owned any slaves in the North or the South in quite some time.

And I've been at work for two hours now.

[orionblamblam]

> It sounds to me like you are offended by the historical facts of the United States of America

It sounds to me like you are confused. The flag of the United States was not used as a symbol by those who attacked Americans to *support* and *maintain* slave-owning rights.

[P-40]

The Northern states ended if peacefully.

They had no shortage of other groups to exploit to clean their toilets. When you have crops in the field, things are a bit more serious.

[Non-Sequitur]

So Fort Sumner was no longer located in the USA and they were requested to leave, but refused.

So? Fort Sumter was still the property of the federal government. Why should they turn it over to South Carolina or the confederacy just because they demanded it? Without compensation I might add.

Sounds like the Federal Government was looking to start a fight to me.

Sounds like the Federal Government was trying to hold on to it's property to me. The garrison at Sumter took absolutely no hostile actions against Charleston or the shipping in and out of the port.

States did have the right to secede from the Union.

But not in the manner the southern states chose to follow. Or so the Supreme Court ruled.

[P-40]

Without compensation I might add.

And why would the South give up an economic asset without compensation?

[Non-Sequitur]

Don't forget General U.S. Grant and Thomas Jefferson.

Or Robert Lee and Thomas Jackson.

[P-40]

Such a blanket claim is impossible to support.

You were quite certain of the function of the CSS Alabama a moment ago...

[Non-Sequitur]

All the sins of the Jim Crow era and the responsibility for them all deserve to be layed at the feet of Yankee Reconstruction governments.

I understand why southron supporters insist on holding themselves blameless anything and everything relating to starting the rebellion, but this is a new one on me. Why is Jim Crow the responsibility of the North? After all it was a system supported by virtually all white southerners for close to 100 years following Reconstruction's end.

[Non-Sequitur]

The war would have been avoided if Lincoln had just ordered the Yankee garrison out of Charleston harbor, it's all he had to do.

The war could have also been avoided if the Davis regime allowed Lincoln to resupply Sumter with food, it's all he had to do.