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Posted on 12/30/2004 7:01:16 PM PST by HairOfTheDog
Oh, and I forgot to say the most important thing! He's very pretty!
Good Morning!
Duchess, I agree, I think he sounds like a fun project but I would also caution to go very slow about getting on and riding. You might want to read some training books to see what the steps are and how much time should be devoted to each step, or ask a knowledgable trainer that you trust. While he's this young I'd make him tote around every manner of thing on his back, trash bags filled with newspaper, tied together and laid across his back is a good one. Of course, you'd want to sack him out before you put all that stuff across his back and go very slowly.
What are your thoughts on this idea, Duchess?
Frog, you are so right and just described Tuffy to a tee. He's 6 years old and still likes to try and see what he can get away with, stuff he knows is a no no. One of my rules for my horses is that if they have a halter and lead on, no eating. They tend to want to drag me or my kids around when they are allowed to eat when haltered. Tuffy still tries to put his head down, even though he KNOWS he's gonna get a jerk if he even acts like his head is going down. My other horses don't bother trying.
She would probably be OK, working with that horse. Some how, kids always seem to carry something like that off:)
Few pointers.
1. Most important, that the horse learns to repsect your daughters space. That he doesn't crowd, or isn't pushy with his head. I wouldn't advise any food treats. A pat on the neck is reward enough.
2. And he should be able to stand tied. If he doesn't know to stand tied yet, she needs to do it. To do it, make sure you have a good strong halter and lead rope that won't break, tie him to something solid, leave some slack but not enough that he could get a leg up over it, talk to him calmly, patting his neck, relaxing him. Then move slowly away. and wait till you see what he does when he bumps the end and realizes he's tied. He could really throw a fit, fall down. Don't untie him. Stay out of the way, but continue to talk to him calmly. It helps if he knows the whoa voice command before you tie him.
3. Actually, IMO, if he doesn't tie yet, this should be step 2, then do the tie up. Work on teaching him to lead properly, using voice commands ALWAYS, kiss to go forward, whoa when stopping. He should always stay in place. IMO:), ANY time you have a halter on a horse, they are working, so they should behave like that. Paying attention to the leader. When a horse has a halter on, it is not their fun time. It's your's:). It's their work time. That does not mean it has to be unpleasent for them, but they do need to learn it's time to go to work.
4. If he leads properly, and responds well to voice commands the next step would be lunging and or ground driving. That can be tricky with a horse whose never done it, but needs to be taught before any riding happens. Start by teaching him to walk the circle. IMO:) especially till they have lunging down real good, and respond perfect to voice commands, should NEVER be allowed to go faster then a trot. If they break into a lope or slow down to a walk, or trys to buck especially, you whoa them firmly (and whoa means a full and complete stop), then immediatly start them back up again. After they are doing it good I only let them trot. This is for a reason. If you "let" them walk they can get lazy, if you let them lope they can get out of control. The whole point of lunging is to teach them who is in control. Trotting is the hardest gait for a horse. If you make them stay at a trot, especially if they are wanting to walk/lope they learn you are controlling, they learn obedience. All of this transfers to when you start riding them.
Once a horse starts to get the idea, especially when first learning lunging, as soon as they go in a full circle around, you stop them. That's thier reward. Rest a few seconds, then try again. If a horse lunges properly, obeys voice commands, I never make them lunge longer then 2-3 complete circles, switch directions, and repeat. Once they do it both directions good, Stop. Lunging in my opinion is not to tire the horse out, but to either teach him to obey, or for one who already lunges properly to see their mood, and refresh for a young horse whose in control. When they don't do it properly you never stop:) Do it till they do it right. If you give up, they have won the battle, and the next time you try it will be twice as hard. But the letting them stop after they have done it right is important, it's the reward. Teaches them it's easier to do it right then to muck around. You'll get farther, IMO, with that reward then with all the food treats in the world.
And at some point lunging can/should be done with the saddle on. You don't have to start that way, but you can. Once they're tieing up and standing tied good (and once they do tie good, it's very good disipline tool to let them stand tied for an hour or so), you can go ahead and introduce them to a saddle. Then once he stands tied good with the saddle he can start lunging with it on.
Just remember to have him leading well and responding to voice commands first before starting the lunging.
These are just things to do with a young horse till they're old enough to ride, besides the grooming.
I'm sorry this got so long:), it's just hard to know what to tell you since I don't know where the horse is at training wise. He's plenty old enough to be doing all this stuff.
Becky
We seem to be doing alot of echoing around here:)
Becky
One more thing then I promise I'll stop:)
As I said it is good to let a horse stand tied for extended periods of time. It really makes working with one easier, IMO, if they HAVE stood tied for awhile before the other work starts. Teaches them patience. I most generally always tie, saddle then let them stand for awhile before doing anything else.
AND, it conteracts them being barn sour if you tie them up and let them stand AFTER the work out. Finishing workouts/rides should NEVER be the most pleasant part of it. Don't feed for awhile after a work out or ride. That just makes them anxious to get back to the barn. They need to learn that just because I get back to the barn something pleasant will happen. Make them work, let them stand tied, and even sometime take them out and make them work again.
All this is just IMO. Others may have different advise, everyone does things different:)
Becky
I wish it were warmer weather - but I guess we will get him one day this week. I'll keep you all posted - I know i'll have lots of question! Stay warm everyone!! Cindy
I think all of your advice is right on the money and I enjoyed reading it.
Nice job Becky and Tuffy!
All the ground work that you both described is great experience for both young horse and rider. But I really wouldn't recommend a relatively inexperienced rider try to break (I hate that word) a young horse to ride.
I did that with one of my mares back when I was green and didn't know how much I didn't know, and although everything was fine, she never bucked a time, she is not nearly as bomb-proof on the trail as Blade, the one I had trained by a professional. I think Blade would walk off a cliff if you asked him to. Now granted, you've got to make sure that the trainer you pick is good at training horses for the riding discipline you choose. I was interested in a good trail horse, so this guy was excellent. He taught him how to go up and down really steep hills safely, climb over rocks and logs, ford creeks, go through really deep mud, and anything else you might encounter out on the trail. He's better than any trail horse I've ever ridden and he's not even 3 yet.
So all I'm saying is, do your groundwork first, then pick a good trainer to do the rest, at least until you are more experienced.
I think he sounds like a great project.... I see many have already offered similar advice about ground work that I would recommend... I would just add this:
She can take him now, work all the ground work on him for the next six months to a year, and get him all ready to be backed. When she can lunge, tie, saddle and drive him, at that point you and she can decide if you really want to to get on, much of it will depend on what you learn about his temperament and her skill and courage in teaching the other things. If there's any doubt, there's no harm in sending him to a trainer at that point for 60-90 days. Consider it his delayed purchase price ;~D
Very good advise. I agree.
Becky
Good point. When I was working with Juma, my first baby, I did all of his groundwork, had him standing tied, picking up his feet, lunging etc and I was planning to be the first on his back but chickened out and sent him to a professional trainer. I really hate pain and I don't heal up as fast as I used to.
The one thing I didn't do that turned into a problem later was loading him in a trailer. I was wishing I would have done that training when he was little...
I would like to see the before pic of that foot.... what happened to him to get him to that condition before? I don't remember the story.
The echo is still around:)
Becky
Trailer loading is something alot of people neglect with foals. I guess until you have to work a full grown reluctant one into a trailer, you don't realize the importance of doing it when they are small.
I've had horses that took me 6-8 hours to get them in. Not fun.
Becky
Great minds think alike.
Trailering brings up another issue... If he's never really been away from Momma, AND has never been in a trailer, you may want to load her to come along for the trip. ;~D
Then put him in a strong place he can't break out of when she goes back down the driveway...
It would be nice if they would wean him from her beginning today while you prepare for his arrival.
Yeahbuddy! Tell me about it. I've got a 16yr old 17 hand TWH that will only get in ONE trailer and you have to have HIS rope run up to the front tie ring and back out and around his butt. You don't have to use it, you just have to have it. He was 26mths old when I got him and had never been loaded. I bought him from from a trader and didn't know enough to ask about that stuff when I agreed to buy him. I didn't know anything about the proper way to trailer load then and needless to say, I did some VERY bad things to him and it's a wonder that he and I both aren't dead. The next horse I got as a 2yr old, the mare I trained myself, I made SURE she knew how to get in a trailer right off the bat. It took lots of time and patience but it payed off. You point her at a trailer, any trailer, and she'll get on. When I started raising babies, I teach them to get in the trailer when I'm teaching them to lead at 1 wk old, coz if I'm rebreeding the mare, they need to be able to go visit the stallion with her. It's MUCH easier this way!
VERY good advise!
Another thing you might want to do is to put him in a separate pasture or corral at first (if you have one), not by himself, but with one of your other horses, I think you said you had 3, who is the lowest in the pecking order. It's best if it's somewhere where they can all see each other but have a fence between them. That way he doesn't have 3 horses ganging up on him and beating him up (and they WILL) right off the bat. He can get accquainted with a less dominant horse first and kinda buddy up for a day or so, then turn them all out together. They'll still run and kick and posture at each other, but it won't be as bad and a whole lot less likely that any of them will get hurt or run through the fence.
When I first brought Bob out to be with Blade and Tennessee, I thought Blade was going to kill him. It shocked the heck out of me. Blade was just 2, but still a stallion. He was still making baby faces when Tennessee (16 yr old gelding) looked at him hard, but when I put Bob in there, it was WAR. They both ended up going over/through the fence. Luckily no one was hurt and I caught them both before they made it out to the road. I took Bob back to his mom right then and didn't bring him back until after I had Blade gelded and taken to the trainer's. That way Bob and Tennessee had a month to get to know each other and Bob had time to get used to being without his mom before Blade came back. It was kinda funny though when Blade came back because it seemed paybacks were in order. Bob ran HIM all over the pasture and tried to mount him like he was a girl. They finally settled down after about an hour. So, it can be a tricky time, just be careful.
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