Posted on 08/17/2025 4:25:45 AM PDT by Renkluaf
Sometimes you can’t help but marvel at how much we’re all willing to pay for the illusion of “green progress.” New Jersey decided—like half the country—that climate purity would be achieved by wind turbines, solar panels, and endless press conferences declaring victory against bad old fossil fuels. But someone forgot to run the numbers, and now the bill arrives, with a little note attached: “Due immediately. No refunds. See: your monthly utility statement.”
Let’s start with the latest funhouse mirror: PJM’s capacity auction. You’ll see the acronym “PJM” all over any story about electricity markets, grid drama, and ratepayer headaches up and down the Eastern seaboard. So what actually is PJM—besides an endless font of regulatory press releases and auction results?
(Excerpt) Read more at wattsupwiththat.com ...
Oil is as natural as it gets. I love nuclear, too. The problem with Democrats is that Democrats love and thrive on chaos. Problem solving is Democrats’ enemy. Problem causing is Democrats’ forte.
Nothing will change until a blue state is flipped red due to failed green policies. Maybe New Jersey will be the first.
These data centers seem to locate near Nuclear Power Plants these days.
I live in a town with a Nuke Plant.
A new data center is working hard to get the approvals to turn a Nursery Stock Farm in giant Server Farm.
Servers like to have a reliable source of Electric Power which Solar and Wind simply can't supply.
The anti-Data Center activist are hyping the fact that electric rates sky rocket wherever data centers are built.
I can certainly see that happening.
It makes sense that Trump is promoting Nuclear Power with this rapid expansion in data centers. Green Energy simply can't provide the needed power.
West Virginia?
“”””AlanJ
August 16, 2025 10:35 am
This piece is a masterclass in blaming the wrong culprit. PJM’s capacity spike wasn’t caused by “green fantasies” so much as three realities: surging demand from data centers, years of underinvestment in transmission, and fossil/nuclear retirements driven by economics, not just policy.
Wind and solar are the cheapest new generation sources on the grid; what’s costly is our failure to build the infrastructure to integrate them. Retail bills reflect transmission, capacity, and fuel volatility as much as generation. Pretending they’re a referendum on renewables is either ignorant or dishonest.
And lest we forget: fossil fuels have given PJM some of its worst reliability failures (see Winter Storm Elliott) when gas plants couldn’t deliver. The grid’s problem isn’t that renewables are “wishful thinking,” it’s that planning, permitting, and market rules are stuck in the past while demand and technology race ahead.
The real question isn’t “how much does hope cost?” It’s: how much longer will we let lazy scapegoating delay the upgrades actually needed?””””
The above is a comment posted by a “climate change addict”. I posted it here to show the mentality of the people who are convinced that solar and wind are free electricity.
I encourage others to read the responses to Alan J.
Nuclear is perfectly natural. No one in a nuclear power plant invokes dark spirits or makes sacrifices to Satan, they merely exploit knowledge of the LAWS OF NATURE. We have been doing this on this green earth for the past 85 years. It’s no more unnatural than penicillin or GPS.
It is absurd we don’t have a high reliability modular nuclear reactor powered generator standard plant, somewhat on the Navy model.
THERE is your non-carbon power source, for those who think CO2 is anything but a plant growth stimulant.
This is a political issue hopefully for the governors race in NJ. As it looks if NJ continues to pursue commie style power generation the whole region will pay. Must be a way for PA and other states to require generation to offset consumption. As Jersey stops generating because they are shutting down power plants, they should pay more for their consumption.
It is absurd we don’t have a high reliability modular nuclear reactor powered generator standard plant, somewhat on the Navy model.>>>. Yes i would like one for my house a nuclear battery. Then if you like solar put up your own unreliable system for each persons house.
The country has been using natural, reasonably reliable sources for producing electricity for many years now. When you add in solar & wind, naturally it costs more because you are adding in another source that costs real money to develop & also just happens to be unreliable. Reliable electric power is a MUST for an industrialized country. Oil, gas, nuclear, hydro-lectric already supply that. Anything additional just costs extra. Developing the existing electrical grid is also a built-in necessity. This doesn’t necessarily leave out wind & solar, tho. There are niche uses for both. It’s just best to leave them out where a constant large frequency controlled controlled source is necessary
I’m thinking much bigger than that, but much smaller than the GW+ plants we build now.
At least small town (say 50k pop.) size.
I’m thinking much bigger than that, but much smaller than the GW+ plants we build now.
At least small town (say 50k pop.) size.
They should use their worn-out windmill blades and solar panels for pavement.
Hi Neighbor, Roanoke area here. Moved in 4 years ago.
I did not know Virginia has so many data centers. I’ll do some extracurricular reading about that.
In this area Big Data is planning to build one on the shores of Carvins Cove - a beautiful lake and forest where members can go to hike and boat and enjoy nature.
If this thing gets built it will be a disaster for us. The rates from Appalachia Power are already too high and we expect them to double to discourage use so the data center can have more.
That may be unreasonable but that’s also the way things seem to be going.
Aside from that, because the lake will be drained and the 24/7 hum from the intended behemoth will mean Carvins Cove will no longer be hospitable to nature lovers.
I’m wondering how to actually disconnect from the power line. If I’ll be made to live as a serf anyway I may as well not pay them for it.
In twenty years what will be a toxic waste site?
It won’t be anything having to do with nuclear.
It will be an EV junkyard and there will be plenty of them.
>>I did not know Virginia has so many data centers.
You’ve got all the FedGov work and all the Internet peering points caused by the legacy of MAE-East in the NoVA area, plus reasonable electricity costs, plus being relatively central on the Eastern seaboard, adding up to a good place for data centers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAE-East
Oregon is also big for data centers.
“In twenty years what will be a toxic waste site?
It won’t be anything having to do with nuclear.
It will be an EV junkyard and there will be plenty of them.”
I saw an EV junkyard on the south side of Beijing China. It must have been about 40 acres filled up with charging stations, cars, electric scooters and buses. There were piles of scooters about 20’ high, cars stacked one on top of the other. There were several hundred buses in long, tight rows.
It makes sense that Trump is promoting Nuclear Power with this rapid expansion in data centers.
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It’s not just the data centers, it’s EVs, electric heat in places like NY instead of gas and an aging infrastructure etc. There are solutions but right now things are galloping ahead on the demand side far faster than they are on the supply side. PJM has been redlining for quite a while and if there isn’t a blackout at some point (I won’t say how far out I’d predict but let’s say well within the year), I’d be shocked.
This being the case, it seems that they are going to have to introduce very rich programs that put large electric users on seriously interruptible demand. How do you run a steel plant, a cement plant or other high electrical demand users like that? They can even introduce very rich demand reduction programs but those take quite a while to implement. Once all the low hanging fruit is gone (think LED light bulbs), they will have to tackle high horsepower motor driven equipment and those projects take years to put in place. As for me, I could see this coming quite a while ago and have taken all kinds of steps on a residential level to make sure that if faced with a blackout, I can roll through it without a problem. I don’t live in PJM territory but as blackouts go, the effects tend to ripple very far. Everyone should have a plan in place that starts with this question.... “What should I do to prepare for an electrical outage that lasts for a week?”
For those really interested in this topic of what is all going on with the grid, you should read The Electric Grandma’s substack… Meredith Angwin is very knowledgeable about the grid and this is what she was saying about PJM over a year ago….. https://meredithangwin.substack.com/p/ten-times-as-expensive-at-pjm?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=2456339&post_id=147307790&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=29dtf3&triedRedirect=true
As Angwin said at the end of this piece a year ago, “Fasten your seat belts. It’s going to be a bumpy night.”
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