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To: AndyJackson

This is not an existential war for Russia.

They can leave Ukraine and go back to the status quo as of 2014, which was pretty good for Russia as I recall. Albeit with a large haircut in their offshore public and private assets.


38 posted on 07/03/2023 3:59:34 PM PDT by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: buwaya
This is not an existential war for Russia.

So you say. But Russia sees it differently. So do the oflks runnign the show. It was supposed to lead to the downfall of Russia.

They can leave Ukraine and go back to the status quo as of 2014, Albeit with a large haircut

First what about those of Russian ethnicity who the Ukronazis begn trying to shell into oblivion in 2014. Second suppose the Russians would rather nuke a couple of carriers than take your haircut.

Maybe the west is in a war it shouldn't have gotten into and can't figure out how to get out of. Ever think about it that way.

43 posted on 07/03/2023 4:03:31 PM PDT by AndyJackson
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To: buwaya

Return to the status quo ante bellum is no longer possible. The US/EU engineered coup of the duly elected government of Ukraine in 2014 led by Victoria Nuland and the Obama/Biden Administration spawned the separatist movement in the Donbas and resulted in the first Russian unopposed invasion that annexed Crimea.

Russia will never relinquish Crimea. Zelensky says that no negotiations with Russia are possible until the borders of Ukraine return to their 1991 status. We are at an impasse and Russia holds all the leverage. Russia shares a 1,500 mile border with Ukraine. It is going nowhere.

We are being led by fools and knaves. Support for this proxy war is rapidly declining in Europe and the US. The sanctions have backfired with most of the world ignoring them, including NATO members Turkey and Hungary.

Our stated goals, per Biden and Austin, have been regime change in Russia and weakening the Russian military. We will fight to the last Ukrainian. We have no treaty commitments to defend Ukraine, which is one of the most corrupt countries in Europe and among its poorest. We have borrowed close to $200 billion to fund this war, including paying for the entire Ukrainian government’s salaries and pensions. We are also paying for some ot the costs of 7 million Ukrainian refugees in Europe and elsewhere. We have drawn down our war reserves that will take in some cases years to replenish. Our open-ended commitment to Ukraine, another endless war, could total well over a trillion dollars.

We are the world’s biggest debtor nation. In addition to the $32 trillion national debt, much of it due to foreign wars, we have over a $100 trillion in unfunded liabilities in the form of Medicare and Social Security. The Medicare Trust Fund is exhausted in 2028 and the SSTF in 2034. By law benefits will be reduced to revenue received. We will have to raise taxes and/or reduce benefits to save these programs.

We have an open Southern border with 6 million illegal aliens entering the country in the past two years. There are anywhere from 20 to 30 million illegal aliens in the country. Over 50% of immigrant-headed households use at least one major welfare program. They are straining our social welfare net and hurting local communities, which must pay for their education, medical services, and incarceration. Mass immigration has depressed American wagfes and resulted in the loss of jobs for Americans. There are over 50 million foreign born in this country, and the highest percentage ever in our history.

Being the world’s policeman has cost us blood and treasure. And now we are back in a Cold War with Russia, with China looming. We are a country in decline. Our voluntary military is having a hard time in recruitment and retention of personnel as a “woke” military talks about white rage and diversity. The incoming Chairman of the JCS wants fewer white pilots.

We have serious problems at home. We don’t need to get involved in more foreign wars that do not benefit our people or affect our strategic national interests. Ukraine is another example of Biden’s stupidity or that he is compromised or both.


54 posted on 07/03/2023 4:35:01 PM PDT by kabar
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