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Envying France, where guns aren't part of the altercation equation
newobserver.com ^ | Dec. 9, 2014 | Matt Buys

Posted on 01/07/2015 11:16:31 AM PST by PROCON

My 10-year old daughter and I visited Paris last month. We stayed in a small, clean hotel with private bathrooms near a bustling train station, Gare Du L’est. Senegalese, Kurds, Algerians, Vietnamese, Bengalese and some Parisians – all call this arrondissement, or urban administrative district, home. This small slice of Paris offers a smörgåsbord of cross-cultural experiences.

Since Gare Du L’est is one of the least-expensive locations in Paris, it is bit rough around the edges. That is, there is a little drug dealing, a little prostitution and lots of who knows what else. Further, my daughter, Katie, had never been to Europe or, for that matter, any country other than the United States. During our first days in Paris, she clinched my hand, without saying anything, tightly. Her grip loosened as we immersed ourselves in the sights and sounds of the different cultures. Each morning as we walked to the Metro, we tried guessing the different languages being spoken and enjoyed eating the Kurdish flat bread as much as the Parisian croissants.

France is a great country. But some French, like some Americans, struggle with diversity. At a local grocery store, we witnessed a white security guard shadowing a young black male. The boy, around the same age as my own teenage sons, had done nothing wrong. He was simply shopping for food. Soon, we saw him irritated by the guard’s menacing proximity. The boy left the store in anger and frustration. As the boy cleared the door, the guard yelled a racist slur. My daughter and I held our breath and looked down.

While we waited in the check-out line, the boy returned with his parents, an interracial couple. They were having none of the guard’s uncalled for ethnocentric behavior and slurs. Suddenly, several other customers chimed in, berating the security guard. Stunned at the outbursts, my daughter and I remained still and silent. In North Carolina, people tend not to raise their voices in grocery stores.

Walking back to our hotel, we talked about what we had seen, trying to make sense of it. How was this racist incident different from racist incidents in the USA? Well, frankly, one glowing difference stood out from the beginning: No one was armed. No one threatened to shoot anyone. Indeed, the fear of violence was significantly lessened by the absence of guns. The white security guard did not fear for his life. The boy did not fear for his life. The other people in the store did not fear for their lives. Neither did my daughter nor I.

In America, with the possibility that the guard, the boy and his parents – not to mention others in the store – might have been packing heat, I would have dropped my cheese and salami, grabbed my daughter and exited stage-right.

How simple the lesson? Remove the fear of guns from the equation, and it reduces the chance, to zero, of anyone getting shot. Moreover, it potentially clears the social stage for, one would hope, intelligent conversation, not to mention making life safer for everyone involved.

In case you did not know, Paris municipal police do not carry guns.

I understand that American cities, Atlanta and Charlotte come to mind, cannot metamorphose into Paris. And I admit I have guns I use to hunt.

But considering the everyday terror and death faced by too many civilians in our own communities, I envy France’s peaceful ways.


TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: banglist; france; guns; unicornsandrainbows
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To: PROCON; the scotsman
The notion that French police are unarmed is untrue. I don't know where people get these ideas.

I've seen French police carrying sidearms in every trip I've made to Paris and Normandy.

Every train station has armed police -- municipal and the French 'State police' -- and at all the significant tourist landmarks like the Eiffel Tower, The Louvre, and the Arc de Triomph I've even seen French Army 'rangers' on patrol with service rifles. There's a pic above in this thread showing exactly that.

I even was witness to an armed police confrontation with some kids acting wild outside my hotel two trips ago.

... and in London, I saw less of the unarmed bobby policemen but lots more of the London police walking around or standing on post carrying Hk MP5s. Saw a group of three shortly after deplaning at Heathrow and at every train stop. The US Embassy in London is a flippin' fortress of armed police outside the gates and the bobbies in Picadilly Square were even patrolling in groups of eight or more all carrying pistol caliber carbines.

A tour guide on one of the 'Big Red Bus' tours that service the London metro area pointed out that special 'flying squad' police cars painted with an blaze orange stripe denoted the segment of police who are authorized to carry guns. I couldn't help notice that I saw more of these orange-emblazoned police cruisers in London than I saw of the other kind of police cars that presumably aren't the kind that carry gun-toting policemen.

I think I wrote TheScotsman last week that I've seen more guns in the hands of British police in three trips to London than I've ever seen in the hands of the Los Angeles Police Department after living in LA for thirty years.

41 posted on 01/07/2015 1:17:21 PM PST by The KG9 Kid
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To: PROCON

I found the dude’s e-mail and I’m really trying to convince myself not to e-mail him and ask him if his opinion has changed.

I figure that it’s a waste of time as people like this won’t ever change til they are directly affected.


42 posted on 01/07/2015 1:48:14 PM PST by KosmicKitty (Liberals claim to want to hear other views, but then are shocked to discover there are other views)
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To: The KG9 Kid
From Wikipedia (yes, I know the warnings) there are 18,000 municipal police in France. Compare that to the fully armed National Police (145,000) and the Gendarmerie (98,000). It looks like they are the third string in the French law enforcement system. At least a couple of their powers mentioned in Wikipedia were about traffic €nforc€m€nt.
43 posted on 01/07/2015 1:52:08 PM PST by KarlInOhio (The IRS: either criminally irresponsible in backup procedures or criminally responsible of coverup.)
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To: Uncle Miltie

” Remove the fear of guns from the equation, and it reduces the chance, to zero, of anyone getting shot.:

Well except for criminal terrorist Muzzies with AK’s. LOL!


44 posted on 01/07/2015 1:58:53 PM PST by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose o f a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: KosmicKitty
He'll just deflect by changing the subject and the nature of the debate into something that he didn't proclaim in his December screed, or point out some irrelevancy like comparing violent crime statistics in Chicago versus Paris.

Whatever he comes up with will sound like demeaning today's body count of 12 in Paris while pointing out that 14 people died Terra Haute Indiana on a tragic bingo bus outing. He'll think he's making perfect sense in talking about what this all has to do with actor David Niven and yesterday's spot price of the Kazakhstani potassium market.

He's entitled to his own comfortable little opinion and nothing you can do will change that or cause him to re-examine it.

After all, what kind of twit is witness to a minor argument in in a French supermarket and becomes inspired to write a self-serving hit piece on firearms when he returns from vacation? THAT'S what was going through his head when Francoise was bring tailed down the rutabaga aisle by the supermarket guard? Puh-leease.

But yes, I would certainly fire off a 'How Now, Brown Cow?' email to him anyway if you're still on the fence about contacting the author.

45 posted on 01/07/2015 2:15:56 PM PST by The KG9 Kid
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To: The KG9 Kid

Tell that to Ms Gilfoyle on Fox.


46 posted on 01/07/2015 4:07:16 PM PST by the scotsman
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To: PROCON

“Remove the fear of guns from the equation, and it reduces the chance, to zero, of anyone getting shot.”

Oh, yes! How are those “Gun Free Zone” thingies workin’ out for ya?


47 posted on 01/07/2015 5:50:45 PM PST by Blue Collar Christian (quod est Latine morositate)
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To: PROCON

“I wonder if the French populace will demand the police be armed now?”

I wonder if the French populace will demand to be armed themselves.


48 posted on 01/07/2015 5:58:12 PM PST by PLMerite (Shut the Beyotch Down! Burn, baby, burn!)
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To: The KG9 Kid

Decided not to waste my time. New gardening catalogue showed up and perusing its pages will be more productive and much less pointless :-)


49 posted on 01/07/2015 6:37:18 PM PST by KosmicKitty (Liberals claim to want to hear other views, but then are shocked to discover there are other views)
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To: PLMerite

Why do Americans think all outside North America aren’t armed?. 19m French have guns. And as we are discussing, almost all French police are armed.


50 posted on 01/08/2015 12:38:20 AM PST by the scotsman
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To: PROCON
But considering the everyday terror and death faced by too many civilians in our own communities, I envy France’s peaceful ways.

Idiot.

51 posted on 01/08/2015 10:36:14 AM PST by denydenydeny ("World History is not full of good governments, or of good voters either "--P.J. O'Rourke)
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To: PROCON

I wonder if Matt has enough sense to be embarrassed by his simplemindedness?


52 posted on 01/09/2015 1:30:18 PM PST by gogeo (If you are Tea Party, the Republican Party does not want you.)
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To: gogeo

leftists do not know shame


53 posted on 01/09/2015 1:33:26 PM PST by GeronL
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