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To: DiogenesLamp

US v. Wong Kim Ark (1898)
“The foregoing considerations and authorities irresistibly lead us to these conclusions: The Fourteenth Amendment affirms the ancient and fundamental rule of citizenship by birth within the territory, in the allegiance and under the protection of the country, including all children here born of resident aliens, with the exceptions or qualifications (as old as the rule itself) of children of foreign sovereigns or their ministers, or born on foreign public ships, or of enemies within and during a hostile occupation of part of our territory, and with the single additional exception of children of members of the Indian tribes owing direct allegiance to their several tribes. The Amendment, in clear words and in manifest intent, includes the children born, within the territory of the United States, of all other persons, of whatever race or color, domiciled within the United States. Every citizen or subject of another country, while domiciled here, is within the allegiance and the protection, and consequently subject to the jurisdiction, of the United States.

His allegiance to the United States is direct and immediate, and, although but local and temporary, continuing only so long as he remains within our territory, is yet, in the words of Lord Coke, in Calvin’s Case, 7 Rep. 6a, ”strong enough to make a natural subject, for if he hath issue here, that issue is a natural-born subject;” and his child, as said by Mr. Binney in his essay before quoted, “if born in the country, is as much a citizen as the natural-born child of a citizen, and by operation of the same principle.” It can hardly be denied that an alien is completely subject to the political jurisdiction of the country in which he resides — seeing that, as said by Mr. Webster, when Secretary of State, in his Report to the President onThrasher’s Case in 1851, and since repeated by this court, “independently of a residence with intention to continue such residence; independently of any domiciliation; independently of the taking of any oath of allegiance or of renouncing any former allegiance, it is well known that, by the public law, an alien, or a stranger694*694 born, for so long a time as he continues within the dominions of a foreign government, owes obedience to the laws of that government, and may be punished for treason, or other crimes, as a native-born subject might be, unless his case is varied by some treaty stipulations.” Ex. Doc. H.R. No. 10, 1st sess. 32d Congress, p. 4; 6 Webster’s Works, 526; United States v. Carlisle, 16 Wall. 147, 155; Calvin’s Case, 7 Rep. 6a; Ellesmere on Postnati, 63; 1 Hale P.C. 62; 4 Bl. Com. 74, 92.

To hold that the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution excludes from citizenship the children, born in the United States, of citizens or subjects of other countries, would be to deny citizenship to thousands of persons of English, Scotch, Irish, German or other European parentage, who have always been considered and treated as citizens of the United States.”


237 posted on 05/08/2013 9:58:32 AM PDT by Nero Germanicus
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To: Nero Germanicus
Here is what is so bothersome in dealing with your side. Not a single thing you posted refutes the point to which you are responding. Since you did not bother to post the message to which you were responding, i'll post it for you, and then it will be YOUR TURN to rebut the point.

Diogenes Lamp wrote:

And I have a Modern day court answer for this. Rogers v Bellei.

A Natural born citizen cannot be stripped of citizenship through inaction.

Now your rebuttal ought not include a reference to Wong Kim Ark unless you can find somewhere in that ruling a place where it says a "natural born citizen" can be stripped of citizenship by inaction. If you can find such text in that decision, then it is appropriate to quote that decision. If you cannot find words to that effect in that decision, then it is merely a waste of both our time's for you to quote that decision.

Now I presume you regard yourself as knowledgeable, intelligent and logical, so therefore I would also presume you understand what is the meaning of "addressing the point."

With that in mind, rebut my statement with a pertinent cite if you can, or if not, do the honest thing and admit the point is beyond reproach.

Back to you.

238 posted on 05/08/2013 11:27:32 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp (Partus Sequitur Patrem)
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