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To: ProgressingAmerica
That depends on how you are defining "the old liberalism." Much of 19th century liberalism was for limited government, what we might call free market or laissez-faire today. Grover Cleveland was a prime example. In the field of ideas maybe William Graham Sumner or E.L. Godkin represent this tendency (I'd have to do more research).

To be sure, though, some of the "old liberals" didn't have much sense of boundaries, so when new collectivist ideologies came along that appeared to be opposed to their own enemies, they didn't resist. They didn't have a demonstration of those ideas in action on which to form a critical judgment. That was true in Britain as well. Some free-trading old liberals couldn't see a clear line between their own ideas and those of the new collectivists.

But in those days or today, many people think of political movements or ideologies as street cars or subways. They aren't trying to get to the end of the line. They just go a few stops down the line to their destination. When hard times come, or a serious scandal or catastrophe happens, or when the country is gripped by a fever of new ideas, they give their support to an idea or movement that promises to rectify the things they see as wrong with the status quo.

I don't doubt that the people you cite may have been 100% in favor of some sort of socialist system. But the reason such ideas are translated into policy isn't because the country wants to reach the end station but because going a few stops down the line looks like a way to "fix" something that people see as wrong. I relate this to the current situation.

The people who voted in the current administration weren't necessarily trying to achieve some sort of socialist future. They were just reacting to events and current conditions and emotional appeals relating to those events and condidions. The people conservatives need to win over to return to office aren't necessarily those who want to restore some sort of prior state of things or push forward to some free market future. They'd be people who see in conservatism an opportunity to mend some things in the country that need mending without embracing some larger vision of how things should be.

10 posted on 03/02/2013 10:13:32 AM PST by x
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To: x

That’s pretty much what I mean. The boundaries were blurred, and without a demonstration they didn’t have a clear line 100 years ago. Most history is incorrectly taught, so people don’t have anchors. They’re drifting, toward that next step in line. As you said, like street cars. That’s a good analogy.

These progressives employ deception in their emotional ploys, and they want everything done immediately so that action is based on everything but well thought out reason.

The darkest part of all is that they control the media. Those who are supposed to be our defenders are the ones pushing us toward an ever expansive state.


14 posted on 03/02/2013 11:14:25 AM PST by ProgressingAmerica (What's the best way to reach a YouTube generation? Put it on YouTube!)
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