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To: philman_36; ArrogantBustard; Dr. Sivana; Tax-chick
Your last question first: WHO gives the Catholic Church the RIGHT to tell you, Congress, and the rest of America that you all have to conform to (the Catholic) vision of social justice via legislative fiat is God and his grant to us Catholics and to those who are (probably like you) not Catholic those rights which are secularly guaranteed by the First Amendment rights of freedom of worship (or not to worship) and freedom of speech and freedom of the press and freedom of assembly to petition for redress of grievances. You already knew that. Its the same source and the guarantee is made by gummint to all of us, regardless of beliefs. This, inter alia, is why we call the USA a "free country."

If you want to claim that the moon is made of green cheese or that Obozo is economically literate and that everyone MUST all agree or that you are descended from apes and we must all agree or that the planet is being ruined by man-made "climate change" and that we must all agree and pay taxes accordingly or any number of other liberal fantasies, hey, go for it! We just don't have to agree or obey and, if we have priorities with which you disagree, you don't have to agree or obey either. If your Congressman or Senators are voting for legislation with which you disagree, whether your agenda is that of Karl Marx or of Lysander Spooner, organize and nominate candidates more to your liking. If you still come up empty, that is why God (or the Founders) invented courts. Take your complaints of unconstitutionality to them. If all else fails, move to North Korea or Andorra or even Fredonia and see if your life improves.

See also Arrogant Bustard's #25 which rightly observes that the First Amendment freedoms are, in fact, freedoms that protect political activism. That they protect more does not diminish that fact. We have a court system that likes to pretend that there is some sort of "right" under the First Amendment for genetically gifted (and/or surgically enhanced) and devotedly conditioned young women to, ummmm, "express" themselves by seductively removing their clothing while provocatively cavorting on stage with various props to excite the imaginations of young men seeking a three-dimensional alternative reality (to their customary two-dimensional magazines) and willing to pay for the privilege of becoming visually excited in such fashion. Such judicial heresies ought not to blind us to what the Founders actually had in mind.

Your problem has nothing to do with being deprived of what you hallucinate might be your rights by the Roman Catholic Church. Whatever your specific gripes may be are best addressed to your elected representatives in the case of public policy or the courts if you actually imagine your actual rights being denied. Good luck!

Your position on immigration by the undocumented folks is both right and wrong. The immigration itself is certainly not a First Amendment issue. It is a Fourteenth Amendment issue. Be really honest and brave (hard as it may be for you) now and actually READ and UNDERSTAND the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment. That amendment speaks of two classes of those protected by it. There are CITIZENS and there are PERSONS. Citizens are the smaller class. However ALL PERSONS are entitled to equal protection of the laws by each state. Like it or not, that means, ummmm, all persons. You don't have to take my word for it. Get any competent dictionary and look up the terms citizen and person.

When the federal courts rule against states trying to enforce the nation's borders by arresting people for being in, say, Arizona or Alabama without some local poohbah's permission (or some terribly indignant folks supporting such claims while baying at the moon shining on the border), you will know in advance why the court would have to rule that way. You can still pretend to be outraged by the inevitable court decision since you are protected by your First Amendment rights. The Catholic Church cannot have you arrested for disagreeing with its agenda and you cannot have us Catholics arrested for disagreeing with yours.

I don't remember a single instance of any authoritative voice of Catholicism supporting abortion, DADT, or gay "marriage." Please correct me if I am drawing the wrong conclusion but your post, therefore, suggests that you support all three. As ever, you have a First Amendment right to advocate all three without necessarily having a right to prevail. The Catholics have a similar First Right to disagree with you but not necessarily having a right to prevail. Of course, murdering innocent babies seems to transcend the status of a mere lifestyle choice (however perverted). Whether legally sanctioned abortion is an inherent violation of the Equal Protection Clause that deprives a PERSON of life remains to be sorted out. That did seem to occur even to the late "Justice" Herod Blackmun in Roe vs. Wade in which he said that IF the unborn were deemed to be PERSONS there could be no right to abort. But I digress.

If you favor abortion, DADT and gay "marriage," that would seem to classify you either as a liberal or as a libertarian. Since you post on Free Republic, I would give you the benefit of the doubt and regard you as not being a liberal. That leaves libertarian. I used to be a libertarian (and a state party officer) in my misspent youth but then Roe vs. Wade was handed down and I grew up quickly. I was in law school when the decision was handed down. I was at the law library desk to get the first copy hot off the copying machine and wanted to know what the geniuses of SCOTUS had figured out (as I could not) as a "constitutional" underpinning for a right to abort (which I then supported). I read Herod Blackmun's decision and the concurring and dissenting opinions and realized that there simply was NO constitutional underpinning for the legality of abortion. My departure from the Libertoonian Party followed soon thereafter. It is a thoroughly false idea of libertarianism that requires uninvited aggression causing the death of the innocent unborn child to service the mere convenience or reputation of the mother and the financial convenience or reputation of the father.

Again, Arrogant Bustard is right (as is still customary whatever you may imagine) and you are not. You are absolutely entitled to disagree with Arrogant Bustard, with me, with other Catholics or with anyone else but, like us, you are not entitled to prevail, only to argue. I can't speak for others but I know I don't care if you disagree.

Your #s 63-67 don't change that in any way.

53 posted on 03/06/2012 1:39:32 PM PST by BlackElk ( Dean of Discipline ,Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Society. Burn 'em Bright!)
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To: BlackElk
Your #s 63-67 don't change that in any way.
Well since this thread hasn't gotten that many replies I have no idea what you're talking about.
55 posted on 03/06/2012 2:05:11 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: BlackElk
A simple question for you...

Is "social justice" a religious precept of the Catholic Church?

56 posted on 03/06/2012 2:06:51 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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