I think that for the purposes of this discussion, "barely a state" is like "a little bit pregnant." Can we agree that birth in Hawaii counts as birth in the United States, and skip the "remote, multicultural, migratory island hub" nonsense?
unlike all the other states(as far as I know) Hawaii is the ONLY state that you cannot trust on the question of whether or not a child was really born there. Do any other states have such a screwy law?
I don't know--I don't know how we would know without researching all 49 other birth certificate policies. But that doesn't mean that said Hawaii birth certificate would list the child's birthplace as "Hawaii." I seriously doubt Hawaii was that lax.
Oh absolutely. I count birth in Hawaii as birth *IN* the United States. I was not trying to suggest otherwise, I was merely pointing out that Hawaii was an "accidental" state. As I mentioned before, even were it not a State, it would still have been a territory, upon which the 14th amendment and other laws would still be operational.
I don't know--I don't know how we would know without researching all 49 other birth certificate policies. But that doesn't mean that said Hawaii birth certificate would list the child's birthplace as "Hawaii." I seriously doubt Hawaii was that lax
And yet I have seen no proof one way or the other. I read articles about Hawaii being used to provide birth citizenship to foreigners in some sort of corruption scheme, but I do not know with what credibility I should regard such charges. The fact that it actually has a law which would ALLOW this, says to me that we cannot be sure they behave in the same manner as other states.
*I* do not know if Hawaii recorded them as having been born in Hawaii, or if they actually DID put down the real place of birth. I do know that what I have so far seen presented as a "certified copy of the original... or an abstract of the record on file" is not convincing as an actual 1961 document.
I have postulated that it is a replacement birth certificated created by the Hawaii Department of Health by a court order regarding an adopted child. I suspect Obama was adopted by his Grandparents in 1971, and his original document is sealed. I think his lawyers got a judge in Hawaii to order the creation of an amended birth certificate or an annulled adoption to produce the document he has now.
As I have mentioned constantly, *I* am an adopted child. I have a birth certificate which was created 6 years after I was born. Very little of the information on it is factually correct. My birth date, time of birth, weight, etc. are all correct, but My name, my parents names, addresses, vocations, etc are all incorrect. I know this because I happen to have a copy of my original as well. :)
I believe there is SOME sort of hanky panky going on with his document, and there are several possible reasons. We Americans ought not to have to guess about this stuff. Hawaii should not be permitted to apply it's privacy laws to the Presidency. All the states have a stake in his legitimacy, and therefore all of them deserve to know what his original proof of citizenship looks like.