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To: GourmetDan
You have it backwards, you assume no cause, purpose, end, goal, etc where all exist.

How do people have these things independent of reality?

Are you saying that people are supernatural?

Your 'logic' is truly bizarre. Except as an idea 'supernatural' doesn't exist. Nothing is independent of reality. Obviously your pattern recognition procedures are in over drive (there is a good evolutionary reason for that) so lets put it to the test.

Lets say that I shake a thousand die and they all come up sixes. Can you tell me the cause followed by the effect? That is your premise isn't it, that everything has a cause and effect?

250 posted on 08/24/2011 6:36:13 AM PDT by LeGrande ("life's tough; it's tougher if you're stupid." John Wayne)
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To: LeGrande
"Your 'logic' is truly bizarre. Except as an idea 'supernatural' doesn't exist. Nothing is independent of reality. Obviously your pattern recognition procedures are in over drive (there is a good evolutionary reason for that) so lets put it to the test."

Your logic is truly irrational. You engage in logical fallacy as a matter of course. Asserting that the supernatural doesn't exist except as an idea is begging the question.

You also say that, "True science (and reality) doesn't have 'causes', 'purposes', 'ends', 'goals', etc., people do." and then claim that nothing is independent of reality. If nothing is independent of reality, then the 'causes', 'purposes', 'ends', 'goals', etc. that people have are not independent of reality and it is incorrect to say that reality does not have these properties.

"Lets say that I shake a thousand die and they all come up sixes. Can you tell me the cause followed by the effect? That is your premise isn't it, that everything has a cause and effect?"

Let's say that I observe a cat spontaneously forming for no reason out of nothing. Can you tell me that there is no cause or effect? That is your premise isn't it, that nothing has a cause or effect?

252 posted on 08/24/2011 7:19:33 AM PDT by GourmetDan (Eccl 10:2 - The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left.)
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