The Barbarians Within America

“We sit by and watch the barbarian. We tolerate him in the long stretches of peace, we are not afraid. We are tickled by his irreverence; his comic inversion of our old certitudes and our fixed creed refreshes us; we laugh. But as we laugh we are watched by large and awful faces from beyond, and on these faces there are no smiles.” … Hilaire Belloc

How many times have you heard someone say that when liberals are out of power their antics are funny … but when they are in power they are dangerous? My guess is you have heard it many times. Most of us are quite familiar with it, in fact.

Today America is living the nightmare … disguised by the Left as the American dream.

“In the end, more than freedom, they wanted security. They wanted a comfortable life, and they lost it all – security, comfort, and freedom. When the Athenians finally wanted not to give to society but for society to give to them, when the freedom they wished for most was freedom from responsibility, then Athens ceased to be free and was never free again.” — Edward Gibbon

Mr. Gibbon could easily have been describing modern day America rather than ancient Athens. America’s coffers are empty largely to provide Americans a comfortable life. And, just lie the Athenians, we are losing everything, our security, our comfort, and most important, our FREEDOM.

We have a government ruled by those barbarians America used to laugh at. And they are solidifying and tightening their grasp on the throat of America’s freedom squeezing it out of existence. Viewing the constitution as nothing more than a speed bump, they are determined to drag America from the pinnacle to the cesspool —

“Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.”

Ben Franklin

"the government strong enough to give you what you want is strong enough to take it all away."

Barry Goldwater in 1964

Sorry I took so long...I have been personally attacked here lately, and wanted to frame my answer exactly correct.

There are those here that want to instill their own personal beliefs upon others, in the way of laws, rules and regulations, similar to what the libs want to, and have been doing to us, but from the opposite side of the spectrum. The largest group of these people are the so called social(ist) conservatives. I actually had one person, in a discussion about morality, tell me that he did not like my moral stand on a particular issue, and because of that had no problem forcing his morals on me...

The tenth amemdment is one of the greatest sticking points I run into. This group wants the federal government to make carte blanche rulings enforcing their personal beliefs, when the tenth amendment makes most issues a states rights issue....and the result is not a spirted debate, but outright attacks and name calling...these people do not even know they are socialists!!!

sorry I am not giving you specifics, but I will not personally attack individuals, because eventually they make themselves known...read posts carefully, and digest what is being said, then ask yourself if this is what the framers had in mind. Once you do that, spotting these people becomes fairly easy

Please do not worry about taking a long time to answer (I don't actually think it was a long time incidentally). Your commitment to trying to make sure your statements are precisely what you mean is very commendable - and in fact a good example to us all.

I'm sorry you have had bad experiences here. This is, however, not an unusual thing. I have gotten into some real flame wars occasionally - and you know, sometimes I have ACTUALLY been wrong! Imagine that! :)

I don't think there's much wrong with people attempting to persuade you to their point of view. This is, after all, a discussion group. We are not discussing trivial things like the state of Paris Hilton's wardrobe either! The topics that get bandied around here are the big ones - life, liberty, ethics, the future of civilisation, and so on. The sort of things that people feel very passionately about, and often have very strong views on. It is therefore not surprising that discussions can get very heated sometimes, and I think we need to make allowances for people coming over as a**holes sometimes.

The problem comes if people attempt to press their arguments by belittling you or your beliefs, or by ridiculing or disrespecting you. It's ok to have strong beliefs, and even to express them strongly - that doesn't neccesarily make you an a**hole. But if you find people doing it consistently, or getting some kind of kick out of it, then you are probably best leaving the thread.

The other point about strong opinions on social topics in particular is that they are often the culmination of a whole series of very distinct ways of looking at the world. You are unlikely to be able to change that opinion without first dismantling all the other structures that make that opinion a perfectly valid and logical one to the person who holds it. That is a herculean task beyond any one discussion thread! So sometimes you have to cut your losses.

I think your lack of specificity and desire not to attack individuals does you great credit. I know the movement you are referring to. I would suggest you point out the hypocricy of attacking Liberals for enshrining their beliefs in law, when they only wish to do the same with their own!

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