Hospice Horror Stories: Health Care System Often Hastens Death, According To The Fiscal Bottom Line

Been there, done that with three close relatives.

It is assisted suicide, without question. One can wrestle with the moral argument all you want, but we have it here now, and have had it for a very long time.

Along with relieving pain, and relieving the sick of consciousness by-and-large, morphine depresses respiration until you die.

The hospice system, in my opinion only, is set up for a couple of reasons. One is a delivery system for morphine, another is to help loved ones of the sick through some of the more difficult parts of caring for the terminally sick, and another is to keep doctors a step away from the process.

If a doctor is administering toxic doses of morphine, it’s a violation of the Hippocratic Oath besides being a liability issue. When nurses do it, they are just doing their job.

I’ve got mixed feelings about the hospice process, but it’s better than dying in a hospital - and was the rational choice of 3 loved ones.

This is indeed a very tricky issue.

I think it is important for a FAMILY MEMBER to be in charge of medication and be the ultimate boss, NOT the doctor.

My beloved grandmother-in-law, in Europe, was 94 and at the end of her long, full life, in a retirement home, and she was suffering from some kind of pneumonia. Breathing was hard, she was coughing a lot, and in her sleep, she was choking. It was HELL for family members to see her lying there gasping.

The doctor decided to up her morphine just to remove some of her pain and discomfort. I think everyone knew that it would cause her to relax so much that she might not be breathing a whole lot longer. This proved to be true — I do not think she lived 24 hours from that point. Every family member felt this was the best thing. This was not assisted suicide as far as the FAMILY knew and the family did approve of the doctor upping the meds to increase the comfort of a beautiful old woman.

We will never know for sure his intent, and we don’t need to. She went to heaven and she was better off for it. It was definitely her time to go.

As a nurse who worked sometime on the cancer floor in the hospital, the amount of pain meds. depends on the patients pain level....most oncologists will order medication to keep the patient comfortable even if it means overdose of the patient.....to withhold pain meds when needed is a crime as far as I am concerned.

I have seen patients that have such large doses of narcotics that would kill you or me and it just allows them enough pain relief to be able to walk the halls....The tolerance to narcotics makes upping the dose a normal thing.

If I were terminal, I wouldn't want pain meds to be withheld just because the doctor or nurse were afraid it might hasten my death...

It a line that all doctors that deal with cancer patients have to work on.....

The intent is relief not death, death is the outcome of keeping someone terminal in a lot of pain or giving them some relief...

I vote for relief of pain....for many the pain can be unbearable...

Can you decide when I will die?

No, but I will.

Read the article again.

My mom had bone cancer in both of her upper legs. She was in a wheel chair so it was hard for her to travel. She was also on bottled oxygen. After several months of consideration she decided not to take any more chemotherapy or radiation.

HER MOTHER MADE A CLEAR AND CONCIOUS DECISION TO DISCONTINUE MEDICAL CARE THAT WAS NOT WORKIING

The only thing she needed was something to control her pain, because the cancer was not going to go away.

HE MOTHER WANTED PAIN CONTROL BECAUSE THEY KNEW THEY WERE NOT GOING TO DEFEAT THE CANCER.

On September the first, I took her to see her oncologist for the last time. They decided together that Hospice could provide her with the care she needed from here on out. On that day my mom was of sound mind and doing well.

ON THAT DAY, HER MOTHER WAS OF SOUND MIND, WAS IN PAIN. SHE AND HER CANCER DOCTOR AGREED THAT FURTHER CANCER-FIGHTING TREATMENT WAS USELESS AND HOSPICE WOULD PROVIDE THE PAIN-CONTROL CARE. SHE WAS “DOING WELL,” BUT SHE WAS ALSO DYING AND EVERYONE HAD AGREED THE CANCER HAD WON, IT WAS SOON GOING TO KILL HER.

Since her mother was of sound mind when she made her medical decisions, who is the daughter to interfere/

Finally, the comment that had Hospice not been involved, her mother would be alive today. With all respect to the daughter, does she forget about the cancer?

Pray her mother is NOT alive, facing the intractable agony of terminal bone cancer pain.

Please never be so foolish as to misquote me.... or assume you understand my sentiments.

It's very simply. The woman was dying. Bone cancer kills very quickly.... and very painfully.

The mother, “of sound mind,” and her doctor decided after a course of radiation and chemotherapy, that further treatment would not cure the cancer. That treatment in itself is wretched.

The mother certainly had the right to chose palliative care, over continued ineffective treatment.

Who is the daughter to tell her she can't?

My mother had 4th stage breast cancer. It had spread to her brain and after radiation she was failing. They assured us her cancer was not active but that she was just giving up. Then the oncologist recommended hospice so I could get more help in the home and the meds would all be “free”.
The first day the hospice nurse visited she asked my mother if she was in pain, my mother said yes. The nurse asked no further questions but began telling me what meds to give. The next day my mother was so out of it she barely recognized I was present. Two days later she appeared to have pneumonia and I revoked hospice and had her taken to the hospital. My brother was on his way home to the States from military deployment and I knew my mother’s greatest wish was to see him.

When admitted to the ER she was so out of it she had no idea where she was or what was happening. I explained that my brother was in the air flying home and would be here the following AM and that I wanted him to have a warm hand to hold and to be able to say anything he needed to say to her whether she understood or not. This meant everything to her and my brother!
The ER dr said he understood, that this happened “all the time” and that he would do his best. However I was called on the phone by the oncologist on duty and berated by her for seeking medical treatment for my mother. Her parting shot was “take the poor woman home and let her go”. Funny thing is that while I spent time arguing with the oncologist about the admission, the drugs hospice had my mother on WORE OFF! Five hours after admission to the ER she was sitting up in bed talking to me and understood that my brother was on his way. The Er dr was amazed at the transformation but my eyes were opened to the fact that she was being over-medicated.
The next morning when my brother and I walked into her room she was sitting up eating breakfast. At the sight of my brother she clasped her hands and said “thank you God!”. Her pain it turned out was not caused by the cancer but because she had no meat on her bones and her butt hurt where the bones were pressing into the skin. The hospice nurse never asked any questions about source of nor did she evaluate level of the pain.
She did however show up at the hospital and started in about pain meds and the need to use them for pain. My brother and I were furious. We would never have denied the medications she needed, but she did not need what that nurse was pushing! I fired that hospice and chose another. By this time I knew the questions to ask and had the strength and courage to tell them what we expected. My mother was awake, alert, pain free and able to spend Christmas with her family around her, eating her favorite pumpkin pie. She passed away in early Jan having an extra two months because I fought for her.

I warn everyone to be careful with hospice. Get involved and ask questions particularly when the discussion turns to medications. Make sure a proper evaluation of pain level is done. Be the advocate for your patient, question everything. The death panels are already here.

This is not the first bad experience my family have had with hospice. My mother feared hosoice becasue of what they had done to my stepfather. I’ve told that story here before.

I am so sorry your mother and your family had such a bad experience. Its tough enough when a family member has a disease such as cancer...

You are right on the fact that people should not be afraid to ask questions and demand answers. You also have the right to refuse a treatment if you want to...

When my father was in the hospital with leukemia they wanted to give him a blood transfusion, and I was with him when the intern came in and told him.....

He told my he didn't want the transfusion, I went to the desk and inform the intern no transfusion, my father wanted to refuse....this is where you have to stand your ground....

The intern said the transfusion was ordered by his doctor, I said too bad, it was being refused...the intern called the doctor and I talked with him on the phone and explained my fathers desires on the subject....the transfusion was canceled.....His prognosis was life span of 10 days to 6 weeks (acute leukemia, when he went into the hospital for colon cancer operation, his blood work was hinky and it took quite a few days to get an accurate diagnosis of acute leukemia) at 85 the idea of chemo for the leukemia before he could have surgery for the colon cancer was not something he wanted...the chemo itself would have killed him probably)

He came to my house by ambulance and lived 10 days from the day of diagnosis until he died....No patient gives up their rights to refuse treatment even if the treatment is for their own good according to the doctor...

All things are measured by patients if they are not afraid to question the why, how and when of any treatment...

Again, your experience certainly added grief to your situation..I am glad your mother and her son got to see each other, you did the right thing in taking the situation into your own hands....good for you..

This is a lesson to other freepers that may have to face the same situation....ask questions and the patient has the right to refuse or even leave the hospital....

My father at another time left a hospital because he didn't want what the doctor wanted....sometimes you have to sign an discharge AMA. It stands for Against Medical Advise and actually protects the hospital from having a patient say he was told to leave...

You had the courage many don't in dealing with medical problems.....you did good girl...:O)

There’s a misperception that pain medication kills people in hospice. While it does put them into a drug induced coma, it is not the agent that kills them. They die from the disease that was killing them anyway, but without the agony of the pain from the disease.

Two years ago, the hospice in Rock Hill, S.C. was a godsend for my dad and his family. My dad lived an active life up until two weeks before he died. As with so many people now after heart attacks, his congestive heart failure eventually could no longer be mitigated with diuretics and other drugs. After a week in the hospital, the doctors said that there was nothing more that could be done for him.

The last week of his life was in a hospice where his lungs gradually filled with fluid and he would have suffered the agony of drowning to death slowly over a course of several days. Instead, morphine was increased as he showed any signs of distress until eventually he was in a drug induced coma. He finally drowned to death without feeling any pain.

I am seeing more and more families who come in with stories of ill family members resting comfortably in hospitals and hospice, who have drips of morphine increased and rapid deaths. The family memebers do not recognize until after then death, that their beloved had been euthanized like a dog.

Then they are terribly guilty and upset.

I would not send my dog to a hospice or a hospital if they were dying. I would never leave a family member at the hosptial alone ever. Death is considered the best answer for most of the frail elderly.

Choose the people who care for you in old age carefully.

Thanks for the thread & the article referenced.

My mom died Oct 10 AT HOME..after I cared for her here as an invalid for 18 years. As a former Hospice & Hospital chaplain I knew that her wishes to be at home etc were extremely valid & I am so grateful I was able to honor this wish.

Now it is much worse than it was then. I will be the first to admit much depends on the individual docs/nurses.. but they rotate & are overtaxed. Finding an ombudsmen for your family member is a joke. I was on the Bio-ethical committee & the horror stories there are beyond the pale. Always the first consideration was “does the person have insurance & HOW MUCH”. Treatment choices went from there.

Yes, no hospital can refuse treatment, but WHAT treatment?

Well, I gave up a lot of years of my life goals & plans but it was the right thing to do.

and yes, the house is empty & lonely now

Although this post has been here for quite some time now and may not even be viewed anymore I still feel compelled to reply. I actually want to clarify something. I never said that I’d rather for my mom to be alive and in horrible pain than to be gone to an eternal resting place of peace. As a matter of fact even though she was highly medicated she still complained of pain. So she wasn’t pain free during the end. My point was this...when SHE signed up for hospice, SHE did not know that SHE was signing her death certificate. Yes, her cancer was terminal eventually. Yes, we all knew she was going to die someday in the near future. But none of us (including her) knew that hospice was going to intentionally overdose her and treat us like we were uneducated idiots that wouldn’t know the difference. I felt like we were mislead and that if she had known that this was going to happen then maybe she wouldn’t have made the same choice. I guess we will never know. I always supported my mother’s decisions whether I agreed with them or not. She knew what was best for her, not me. Of course I loved her and I wanted to hold on to her as long as possible. But I’m not selfish and I did respect her wishes, ALWAYS!!! I realize every case is different, and I just wanted anyone else having to make the same decisions to be aware of the things they don’t tell you. OUR experience was no different than legalized euthanasia.

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