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To: hecht

He will: * Prohibit salary scales based on seniority * Grant raises based on classroom performance * Give tenure based on classroom performance.”

Bill Clinton tried this in Arkansas in the ‘80s to garner support for the ‘education Governor’ - pencil and paper tests will not measure ‘good’ or ‘bad’ teaching; Clinton was effective in wasting 2-3 million dollars of taxpayers’ money on silly tests which accomplished nothing...

I’m pleased, as a teacher/professor of over 40 years, that his ‘plan’ includes ‘classroom performance’ which, to me, means that a competent overseer will visit the classroom and will witness the teacher in action. I once worked in a middle school (many years back) where the principal and three assistants visited my social studies classroom three times each, total of 12 visits. I felt they knew what I was doing and my style and rapport with students. If Christie’s measures include scores on tests, the universities where teachers graduated already have this; you cannot measure teacher effectiveness unless you have guidelines and specific, measureable behaviors that can be observed. Then, the most effective step in all this measurement: follow-up with the overseer, who is hopefully a competent teacher who knows the qualities and behaviors of effective teaching.


9 posted on 09/28/2010 3:31:09 PM PDT by choctaw man (Good ole Andrew Jackson, or You're the Reason God Made Oklahoma...)
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To: choctaw man; wintertime; BruceDeitrickPrice

Pencil and paper tests, if they aren’t set at the level of the 8th grade, will identify the many semi-literates currently receiving welfare in NJ by pretending to be teachers.

As for the literate and at least theoretically capable, the L.A. Times has had a “value-added” evaluation performed of every teacher in LAUSD. “Value-added” is the right measure and is vastly preferrable to someone coming in to visit.

Schools of education need to closed everywhere. They are cesspools of stupidity masquerading as bastions of expertise and have ruined the lives of many children by inflicting absurd pedagogical theories and by promoting a marxist worldview.

Of course, the real solution is to get rid of our single-payer, socialist government school system with all of its “experts”, administrators, facilitators, bureaucrats, board members, etc. Nevertheless, if Christie follolws through with a real test, the taxpayers of NJ will be shocked to find out who they have been paying large salaries plus benefits to as teachers in NJ.


21 posted on 09/28/2010 3:49:32 PM PDT by achilles2000 ("I'll agree to save the whales as long as we can deport the liberals")
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To: choctaw man

Why is it that tests are used inside the classroom by the teachers to give the students grades for the year and that’s OK yet, when the subject comes up of using tests from outside the classroom to see how the students are doing that’s not OK?

If you want to get certified for just about anything in the business world there are standardized tests for them. From Real Estate salesmen to IT professionals (government tests to private industry tests). Most places require attendance at a certified school prior to being able to take any of the tests for that given field. How is this different then the public schools? and why is it so difficult in creating these tests (millions of dollars)?

The concept of generalized testing isn’t a ‘new’ idea nor is it rocket science. The problem I see is that the public school system is pushing back and making it as difficult or as impossible as it can so that it can do what ever it wants however it wants with no accountability.

These tests don’t have to be mini SAT tests, something as simple as 10 questions (from a pool of a hundred or so) in each of the core fields should be enough to show that the student has a basic understanding of the subject well enough.


44 posted on 09/28/2010 5:03:20 PM PDT by thatjoeguy (Wind is just air, but pushier.)
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