Posted on 07/07/2009 6:33:08 AM PDT by joeclarke
Why must I first understand that?
I do not ignore that.
Holy Eucharist is the same sacrifice (on Calvary), re-presented.
It implies that without the Eucharist the salutary power would not be applied.
Such is your misinterpretation. The phrase "it's salutary power" refers to Christ's sacrifice on Calvary, the one-time sacrifice which is re-presented in Holy Eucharist.
It’s like asking if Pentacostals can be Christians.
So too says the Catholic Church.
Hi Joe,
Your Journey is similar to mine and has some way to go as does mine. From what I can see though the Catholic Church has kept it’s stance on moral issues while other denominations seem to be capitulating to the the morals of the day. This really does say a lot as the satanic forces of our day beat upon the walls and gates of the Catholic Church like waves crashing against a clifface, with little or no effect while other Churches succumb to the ebb and flow of the tide of opinion.
I still have problems with some Catholic ideas but what I realise is that although I may never overcome these problems or concerns the problems are essentially mine!
Blessings
Mel
Such is your misinterpretation. The phrase “it’s salutary power” refers to Christ’s sacrifice on Calvary, the one-time sacrifice which is re-presented in Holy Eucharist.
_______________________________________________________
1367 The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice: “The victim is one and the same: the same now offers through the ministry of priests, who then offered himself on the cross; only the manner of offering is different.” “And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner. . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory.”190
So the continuous sacrifice of Christ (reconcile: “It is done”) is truly propitiatory — the act of the Eucharist forgives sins. Once again, I think you are soft pedaling the theology. I will say on your behalf that the theology is confusing (one sacrifice does not equal repeated sacrifices).
It is the Key to understanding the majority of the Scriptures. Without understanding the Death of Mankind, wrought by Adam upon the human race, the miracle of faith and what God has done, cannot be seen; The depths of Sin's terrible reach is grossly underestimated.
When one believes that they have made their own faith and belief, then the doubts about whether they are Saved and the lack of Assurance of that Salvation - abound.
When one believes there choice of God brings them Salvation, then, in the back of ones mind, one worries that a misstep could undo that Salvation (that one can UNCHOOSE). And indeed - that is where that Theology leads.
WHAT TO DO: Ask God, the Holy Spirit what "Surely Die" means". Ask what "He who Believes Has Eternal Life" means.
Be assured; for folks like us, the Greatest Teacher will answer.
Bzzzt. "Continuous" is your misinterpretation.
I will say on your behalf...
YOU will say on MY behalf? LOL I rebuke your efforts to stuff words in my mouth.
...(one sacrifice does not equal repeated sacrifices).
So what? This is not a question of "repeated" sacrifices.
Again, it is the one same sacrifice on Calvary, re-presented.
Our beliefs differ, thanks
Adue.
The answer to your question is simple but a bit of a different direction than you might expect.
On Judgement Day, will you have to answer for another?
Will your priest or pastor answer for you?
Answer - no, you will stand alone before the most perfect God and give an account for all that you said and did and all that you did not say and do.
And in that terrible moment, when you are measured against perfection, will anyone be able to intercede on your behalf to cover your transgressions? There is only one who can - Jesus.
So focus on doing what is right by Jesus and let God worry about separating the sheep from the goats.
Gotcha. The sacrifice isn’t continuous or repeated, it is re-presented, no synonyms allowed. You are hiding behind semantics and definitions without explaining your semantics or definitions. If the sacrifice was done once and was efficacious in absolving us of our sins, why is it continuing by being re-presented? Get to the crux of the matter, pun intended.
Protestants by and large believe that communion is an act of remembrance — a serious thing — but that it has no effect beyond the remembrance and it does not re-present the sacrifice of Christ in that it does not resacrifice him or continue his sacrifice.
Catholics believe that the Eucharist is the sacrifice of Christ.
No it isn't...It is a representation of the Last Supper...Unless you guys are nailing something to a cross at every Mass that you haven't told us about...
You don't get to make that decision.
And again, on the topic of the Catholic Church, you are wrong.
I for one do not like arguing over religion.
I was Protestant and at 10 gave my life to Jesus, went to very good Bible teaching churches. Proud of that.
23 years ago, my journey carried me to the Catholic Church.
I am grateful, complete and happy.
When I came into the Church, I said, “My journey is complete, I have the whole truth. Not a piece of the pie, but the whole pie.”
The Catholic Church is the one true Holy Catholic Apostolic Church. It is complete.
It is full of sinners, imperfect believers, remember Judas. She is full of Judas’.
Certainly do...The eating of the flesh and the drinking of the blood is NOT the Crucifixion...God made that clear in the scriptures and He told me to study the scriptures...
Your re presentation of the Crucifixion is NOT eating the flesh as you claim...That's as clear as a crystal...
The ingorance of Catholicism in so many of these posts should be shocking but it is “par for the course”. The one thing I’ve learned about the internet is that so many people think their opinion is fact.
So the Body of Christ is full of hell-bound sinners, eh???
You should have spent more time in the scriptures before you crossed over...
Nope. Your statement is pure hubris.
The eating of the flesh and the drinking of the blood is NOT the Crucifixion...
For those whose interest in this question is true and charitable:
1367 The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice: "The victim is one and the same: the same now offers through the ministry of priests, who then offered himself on the cross; only the manner of offering is different." "And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner. . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory."190The entirety of the teaching of the Catholic Church on the Eucharist is too rich to be glibly captured in any one post.
This portion of the Catechism goes into great depth.
I am not one to interpret other people’s words on a message board, but when I read rose’s post, it seemed that she was saying we are an imperfect people. I know I am a terrible sinner. That is why I need Jesus Christ.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.