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To: teeman8r
"there is no right of irresponsibility, only consequences... "

Or at least there should be consequences.

The implication is that the "right of the people to keep and bear arms" covers doing so irresponsibly.  The problem I have with that is that keeping and bearing arms irresponsibly can have consequences to more people than the person who does so.  If someone keeps a ton of black powder in the basement, and due to that person's irresponsibility the ton blows up, a whole neighborhood may suffer the consequences--possibly before the someone if he wasn't home when the powder blew.  But what you say is food for thought and I'll chew on it awhile.

 

"should paroled felons be denied the right to bear arms"

In the opinion of some people, basic rights can't be denied at all, but can only be disabled--made ineffective.  That's why in some jurisdictions freed felons are said to be under disability, some of their rights have been disabled.

As to your question, if a jailed felon can rightfully be denied the right to bear arms because he's in jail as punishment, a paroled felon can  rightfully be denied the right to bear arms because he is only on parole and has not completed the punishment for the crime.  In my opinion, whether or not he "should be denied" the right as a parolee depends on the felony he committed. 

There are way too many felonies.  If he committed a felony that shouldn't really be a felony, some paper work mistake that people can get nailed for, I don't think he should be denied the right to bear arms.  If he abused the right to bear arms by committing a felony with an arm (I don't mean he happened to have it in his pocket, I mean he actually used it) then being denied the right to bear arms should continue to be part of the punishment.  And there's a whole range between those two cases where sometimes the answer would be yes and sometimes no. 

And that's my answer to the particular question:  Sometimes yes, sometimes no.

That leads to the question of whether or not a felon who has been released from punishment, not paroled but freed, "paid his debt to society", should be denied the right to bear arms. 

But first the question of whether or not a felon can  rightfully be denied the right to bear arms to begin with.  I would say that if we can  rightfully execute someone for a crime, thereby denying the right to life, or  rightfully imprison that someone, thereby denying the right to liberty or at least restricting it, then we can  rightfully deny that someone the  right to bear arms as a part of the punishment.  I would say that we can  rightfully continue that denial after release from prison only if we acknowledge it as a part of the punishment, which I'm not sure we do now. 

As to whether or not a freed from prison felon should be denied the right to bear arms as part of continuing punishment, my response is pretty much the same as it is for the parolee.   In short: sometimes yes, sometimes no.

 And if the answer is "no", maybe the felon should not have been freed from prison.

20 posted on 03/27/2007 8:44:59 PM PDT by KrisKrinkle
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To: KrisKrinkle

"But first the question of whether or not a felon can rightfully be denied the right to bear arms to begin with. I would say that if we can rightfully execute someone for a crime, thereby denying the right to life, or rightfully imprison that someone, thereby denying the right to liberty or at least restricting it, then we can rightfully deny that someone the right to bear arms as a part of the punishment. I would say that we can rightfully continue that denial after release from prison only if we acknowledge it as a part of the punishment, which I'm not sure we do now. "

well stated and you have given me pause to rethink my standing... as a libertarian, i have always felt that rights are unsinkable... once out of prison... the reinstitution of the application of the rights are a no brainer... as for the execution... that to me has always been the ultimate penalty for crimes against humanity...

not necessarily a denial or infringement on the right to life...

but as i said... rethinking as we post...

too many times zero tolerance and minimum sentencing and the all inclusive equal protection tend to have our judis prudence panties wadded up around the old addage that some people need killin more than others...

the commandment is after all, thou shalt not commit murder... not kill.

teeman


21 posted on 03/28/2007 3:53:33 PM PDT by teeman8r
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