Economists are Making a Grave Mistake (Downsides of the Law of Comparative Advantage)

Gone with the Wind blog ^ | unknown | Gone with the Wind blog

[John Filson]

How could we tell the difference either way?

[NormalGuy]

We've all seen, "Americans have no right to a job."

No capitalist/libertarian is saying that. What we are saying is that there does not need to be Affirmative Action or a set aside for citizens anymore than there needs to be affirmative action for a sub-set of those citizens such as Blacks or women or gays.

We are saying that there are plenty of jobs available. The high paying jobs require some type of skill or track record or success.

Some people just don't want to do what it takes to get the job... or to get the good job. Some people insist on making buggy whips and expect protection when in fact the best thing for them would be a tough love program of not protecting the buggy whip industry.

I'm a prime example. It is my own fault and nobody else's that I do not have a college degree. It is my own fault that I know ZOS-COBOL-DB2 (and lucked out as the high paying jobs are there). It is my own fault that I do not know Java-SQLJ which is also hot, or VB which is now on the trash pile of history. It is my own fault that I would let certain high paying jobs stress me out and thus I avoid those high paying jobs. It is my own choice that I am a contractor who does not want to make a permanent committment to any company... or even career.

However any cash gifts of sympathy will be welcome. I just don't expect to force you to send those gifts.

[NormalGuy]

Government contracts to "train" displaced workers and to counsel them. Especially the latter. Here is the new dot con (yes, con).

Yes. You understand the game. I've known those displaced workers... COBOL programmers who took VB classes paid for by the government. Now they refuse to go back and do COBOL that is paying 6 digits but the VB work is hard to find and entry level doesn't pay as much as their unemployment comp based on their high COBOL salaries.

[NormalGuy]

free trade with, for example, Mexico or India, but want more restrictions with the PRC. I am into the more classical, nation by nation bilateralism

I'm with you. Trade with a relatively free Mexico or India will encourage even more freedom and prosperity and can be designed to be "free trade". But free trade with a non-free China-N Korea-Vietnam is impossible. Any trade with them should be strictly if it is possible to gain a one-sided advantage... eg if they need us more than we need them. That is where Jimmy Carter blew it with N Korea. They needed us more than we needed them and Carter felt sorry for them and was one-sided favoring their side over ours.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

I cannot argue with what you said (in all three replies, 102 - 4) though it's unsettling to see hiring an American as possibly some form of Affirmative Action or a set aside. (However that response may have been caused because I failed to give context for the "No American has a right to a job" thing. See below)

I have to ask, where's the proof that in a majority of the cases the foreigner is superior to the American? That is rhetorical. I am not saying that that is your argument.

I am not trying to start an argument.

Here's where I am coming from. I've worked with H1B programmers. They are just like us, some were very good, some good, some average, and some not so good. I suspect they would be the same if they worked from their home countries via outsourcing offshore.

Secondly, for years both on FR and elsewhere, ever time I see someone praise the superior Indian -- it's always been the Indians -- owing to his education I post articles from the Indian press describing the sorry state of Indian education, in the authors' opinions, owing to teaching to pass tests rather than do creative thinking.

I also recall network TV news items in the pre-PC days of John Cameron Swayze that appeared annually showing rioting in India because the university attempted to prevent cheating on finals. There have even been some contemporary riots, also.

I also post the letter sent to graduate schools here from the Educational Testing Service (ETS) warning them to be wary of GRE scores submitted from India, China, etc. A copy of the letter was on the Internet.

The ETS actually suspended the Computer Science GRE a couple of years ago due to widespread cheating in India, China, etc.

I am NOT saying that all cheat. But clearly enough do to, in my mind, raise questions.

As far as Americans have no right to a job, in its purest meaning the statement is true. I was remiss in not giving context. Carly Fiorina, former chairman and chief executive officer of Hewlett-Packard, made a similar statement defending outsourcing offshore. Some Freepers have expressed the same feeling.

I would suggest that Ms Fiorina, et al. outsource offshore the protection of their respective butts and fortunes.

[NormalGuy]

The management mistakes of the Fiorina's are a major reason for the sorry state of US business. So interesting that you bring her up.

I agree with you on Indian culture. At IL colleges there is "cheating" by Indians, using "our" definition of "cheating". Part of the issue is the concept of "collaboration" and "teamwork". In boxing we object to a 2 on 1 fight. But in football it is teamwork for many players to tackle the ball carrier.

Some Indians specialize. One takes all the English courses for his group of friends. Another takes all the math courses for the same group of friends. Another sits back and does nothing because his family has the money to pay for it. When fraternities do the same thing we criticize it... and laugh.

There are different concepts of how to use the internet. Some use the internet to go to the IBM manual and find the answer. Some use the internet to ask some anonymous poster on a chat like DB2-L what the answer is and then let others debate the accuracy of that answer before adopting the majority answer ...and sometimes the wrong answer.