A Magic Bullet for the Anti-Schwarzenegger Camp (Option B for McClintock Supporters)

My own thoughts... | 09/22/2003 | DoughtyOne

[DiamondDon1]

Hey D1:

As this thread rapidly approaches a total meltdown, I would like to suggest that we stand back from the Arnold / Tom saga, and do more research on Cruz and Davis (with graphics for them instead of the cross-fire graphics we have now...).

Just a thought...

DD

[DoughtyOne]

I considered doing this, but realized it would only turn into a downward spiraling road to infighting. What's the point of doing that vs this?

This was a valid observation of a real issue that has presented itself on the forum. Even some of the more enlightened people on the forum have advanced this idea. I'm tired of ignoring it.

[BonnieJ]

If California conservatives could find a persuasive, dynamic, highly accomplished, focused (on the opposition), truly likable, ethical, adaptable candidate, could he win in California?

From what many of us have observed in these brief 6 weeks or so, McClintock does not fit this description. Simon actually was better suited and ran a more admirable campaign.

I just wonder where the other 66% of the votes will come from to elect a conservative, if only 34% of the state is registered Republican. And not all of those are conservatives, anyway. Some are what so many here would quickly label RINO's.

I would see Arnold as you do, the better of the two major candidates. It has taken me a while to get past my image of him as a movie star. Going form Terminator to governor in a couple of months is a real leap for many to take. But he does have good ideas and he is a leader and he most likely will find ways to begin to resolve the problems. He has surrounded himself with a variety of consultants, much the way Pres. Bush has. And they are from the entire philosophical spectrum, as is proabably needed in California.

[DoughtyOne]

Any time the McClintock camp wanted to call a truce, they could have. All they had to do was stop trashing Schwarzenegger. I begged them to knock it off. What could I do? What can you do? This is the only way they know of to support Tom, and even though it hasn't gained them one vote, the same tactics continue.

I would gladly have spent the last month developing positive stuff for Tom and negative stuff for Cruz. Yeah, you go to the McClintock camp and hand them this proposal. When you draw back a bloody stump I'll be here to help.

[BonnieJ]

Simon came withing striking distance of defeating Davis because Democrats were not motivated to go to the polls. They hated Davis, that is obvious from his approval rating. They are motivated this time as they usually are. I don't think a true conservative will have that high of a percentage again...do you?

[Tamzee]

Hi!

Click here and about 12 or 13 down on the list is a slide-show of recall photos... I noticed several very good ones of Tom you might like :-)

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=s&u=/static/slideshow_archive2&ga=pl&max=0

[deport]

Poll	Schwarzenegger	Bustamante	McClintock	Ueberroth	Huffington
RCP Average	28.8%	29.3%	15.3%	4.8%	2.8%
PPIC (9/8-17)	26%	28%	14%	-%	2%
LA Times (9/6-10)	25%	30%	18%	8%	3%
Survey USA (9/6-8)	39%	29%	16%	6%	3%
Field Poll (9/4-7)	25%	30%	13%	5%	3%
Stanford U (8/29-9/8)	40%	28%	8%	7%	1%
Cal C of C (9/1-4)	28%	33%	12%	10%	3%
Survey USA (8/23-25)	45%	29%	11%	6%	3%
LATimes (8/16-21)	22%	35%	12%	7%	3%
GL Res. (8/13-18)*	31%	25%	17%	8%	3%
PPIC (8/8-17)	23%	18%	5%	4%	3%
Field Poll (8/10-13)	22%	25%	9%	5%	4%
Gallup (8/7-10)	42%	22%	13%	7%	7%
Time/CNN (8/8)	25%	15%	9%	4%	4%
*Republican Pollster, Simon votes reallocated to voters' second choice.

RCP

[Kevin Curry]

. . . you folks seem to agree this is conservatism's best choice this time around.

McClintock is by far conservatism's best choice this time around. Thus McClintock gets the vote.

It's pretty straightforward, really. No need to play Machiavellian games of misdirection. That's your M.O., not mine.

[Rabid Dog]

I'm not responsible for the McClintock "camp" so there may have been posters that did that. However, it doesn't make it right if they compared it to another poll. If the discussion was based on just the LA Times results - then it was fair game - but most of us who live here in So. Cal know that the LA Times isn't the best source of info under any circumstance. Posters from out of state probably wouldn't realize that.

I think deport is going to try to post the table and from there you can get the actual wording. The PPIC is a 37 page pdf document - the LA Times was about 16 pages or so.

I believe the website is www.realclearpolitics.com.

[Rabid Dog]

Thank you deport - you are a wonder and I bet you have that table memorized!

[DoughtyOne]

Tom McClintock's platform is almost identical to what I'd like to see in a candidate. Bill Simon was more to the left of McClintock, than in full agreement.

If McClintock were the only candidate now, the left would savage him on his immigration and other conservative views. Completely ignored by the TomBot camp is that the Democrat adds out here are completely ignoring the republican candidates.

Schwarzenegger is the only person who goes out and talks about changing the direction of the state. Tom talks about himself. Arnold talks about change. Davis talks about No on recall. Bustamante talks about himself. Then there are No on the recall adds as well. The only person talking about change, is Arnold.

The republican infighting reminds me of this.

A man and girlfriend go out for an evening walk. After they've gone about two blocks, another suitor walks up and tries to horn in on the man the woman was with.

Taking offense this man that started the walk with the woman starts a fight with the new suitor. While they roll on the ground, a third man comes up and rapes the woman. The two man are too damned stupid to realize it's more important to defend the woman than to win the fight they are involved in.

This is California in a nutshell, but I'd like to mitigate one thing here. Schwarzenegger might be the guy who tried to horn in on the other guy's date, but at least he's the one that's trying to break free to defend the woman.

[Rabid Dog]

I'm afraid to look - are they nice ones?

[Dave S]

DoughtyOne, some of these McClinton goofballs arent clever enough to know that you are being sarcastic. They may think this is a great idea. Many of them are already talking about voting No on the Recall to make sure that Arnold doesnt win. They've already given up on blinky. Somehow they think the people of California will raise up in armed revolution if they are forced to deal with another three years of Davis.

[FairOpinion]

"Those recomendations make more sense than voting both for the recall and Tom. (Especially when knowing that Tom can't win.) That would be jumping out of the frying pan into the fire. "

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Tom can't win, but Arnold CAN, even with McC in the race. But I surely hate to see Arnold beat Bustamante, but it's meaningless, because Davis doesn't get recalled.

[DoughtyOne]

Let's say your method is the best method to figure out where McClintock is. A 9% rise in five weeks is okay. There are two weeks left. Even if Tom rises another 4.5%, what is that going to accomplish? 19% is not going to take this election away from Bustamante is it.

[Tamzee]

Peace offering to the McClintock Camp :-)

[Tamzee]

I thought they were nice myself.... he just seems uncomfortable in front of a camera, like most of us.

When the camera catches him unaware, he looks great :-)

[Snuffington]

I remain puzzled why some people see electing Schwarzenegger as a goal unto itself. What exactly does a California conservative expect to get out of that proposition? I may have missed something, but he doesn't seem to be promising to promote a conservative agenda, or even to oppose a liberal one.

But that "R" behind his name will allow the Democrats to play the inevitable further problems in the state on the Republican Party. To me that seems like tossing away the best issue for the next general election awfully lightly.

Arnold's conservative support ought to fit in some way with the enactment of at least some part of the conservative agenda. While I see a lot of assumptions and hopes, I'm not seeing much substance addressing this.

[EllaMinnow]

Why in the world did this thread get sent to the backroom?

[Teacher317]

If they vote "No" on the recall, then "Bustamante", they'll achieve the victory of blocking Arnold Schwarzenegger from becoming California's next governor. After all, that seems to be the worst case scenario for them.

Could you cite the thread or FReeper quote that made you think this was the "worst-case scenario" for McClintock supporters here?

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I didn't think so... but thanks for being so disingenuous anyway.