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If you're telling me that most people will choose to do nothing about any of these trends, I wholeheartedly agree with you. We will ride them to wherever they go. To that extent I feel a little like Mr. Spock on the bridge of the Enterprise. "Sensors indicate a large and growing fraction of men refusing to participate in marriage." To which the answers are variously things like 'Men should stop whining,' and 'If they would just find a nice Christian girl, everything would be fine,' or 'Well, I've been married for 25 years, and I don't see any problems.' To which I can only reply, "Fascinating."

I hope to find me a "nice Christian girl" someday. I know for me, it would be satisfying but that is only a very small part of the problem. It is like holding the line. It is a good strategy in the short term to prevent from being overrun but as time goes on, you will be. So where does that leave us? I'd love to see us go on the offensive, have a "take no prisoners" attitude like the liberals and libertines have but is there enough of us to win?

Ever since I've been surfing the net, I've noticed an interesting trend. Some people who feel like us have basically just chucked the rest and formed their own insular communities. I've seen this with many Christians who form their own communities with their own schools, shops, businesses, etc. Maybe this is what we need to do. Maybe form our own communities and after "The Collapse" when some form of Atlas would shrug, then we'd be in a position to survive and perhaps rebuild. My father seems to think that in my lifetime, I just turned 37, that the United States will collapse and break up if things keep going the way they are.

I know that's a bit nihilistic but sometimes I wonder if it would be a good idea to form communities or when things break up, have our own separate nation of sorts. The liberals and libertines can have their nation until they screw it up, if they would leave us alone to have a decent place to work, live and raise families. As I get older, when it comes to conservatives/Christians vs. liberals/libertines, I feel that segregation of those two philosophies is the true answer. We break off from them or they break off of us nd go our separate ways.

Throughout the last 30+ years, we have seen the trail of woe that the radical liberals, feminazis, peace nuts, hippies, and so on have laid down. That's why in my last message, if I had a time machine and the means to do so, I would try my best to abort the cultural changes of the 1960's. Everytime I see old films, pictures, and even the "Neo-hippies" of today, I feel nothing but rage. I want so much to walk up and punch their lights out and say, "thanks for taking my country away from me." I really weep at what has gone on in my culture and country. I wish I could commandeer all the C-130's at the local Air Force Reserve Base, round up all the hippies and neo-hippies, load 'em up and fly them to Cuba where the belong so they quit bugging us.

I know I'm getting a bit verbose here, but like you, when I get going, I write a lot. I just felt like I wanted to write down every thought going through my head. If somebody should read this and say "I'm an angry male," all I can reply is "guilty as charged."

I know that's a bit nihilistic but sometimes I wonder if it would be a good idea to form communities or when things break up, have our own separate nation of sorts. The liberals and libertines can have their nation until they screw it up, if they would leave us alone to have a decent place to work, live and raise families. As I get older, when it comes to conservatives/Christians vs. liberals/libertines, I feel that segregation of those two philosophies is the true answer. We break off from them or they break off of us nd go our separate ways.

The Free State Project - although I think this is more of a Libertarian group.

My father seems to think that in my lifetime, I just turned 37, that the United States will collapse and break up if things keep going the way they are... I know that's a bit nihilistic...

It's always hard to tell, except in hindsight, where nihilism ended and Pollyanna-ism began. Prophets of Doom have always been with us, and usually they are wrong, so 'doom' scenarios don't have a good track record. They do happen, though. I imagine there were guys toward the end of the Roman Empire holding signs that warned of "Dark Ages to Come" if the slide were not arrested.

To me the 'doom' scenario is Western Civilization being overrun and wiped from Earth, as the birth rate declines and finally goes into free fall, as it has done now in Russia and Italy. I don't think that's out of the question; we could be facing a Chinese Russia and an Islamic Western Europe sooner than we think. The last ethnic Germans and French will be living under Islamic Law. That's probably not what they would prefer if asked today, but unless some shock is applied to the system I don't see what can keep it from happening.

There is an economic crack-up scenario on the table that looks a lot like the implosion of the Soviet Union. That could occur if the marriage-divorce thing festers long enough, although it's hard to tell whether that would be good news or bad. Russia's birth rate went into free fall after things started getting better there.

Another "might happen" is the arrival on the scene of a Lech Walesa figure, probably in response to some highly symbolic event such as a Supreme Court decision that was seen by some huge number of men as unambiguously branding government as the enemy of its male citizenry. A general strike by men would absolutely be enough to rip the whole marriage-and-divorce court system out by the roots, even if only 30 or 40 per cent of men participated. Depending on just how symbolic the "symbolic event" was, that number could go up or down. That one might be the best possible outcome.

I don't have a lot of faith in the "squeak by" scenario. I don't know where the propensity of young men to avoid marriage will peak... I doubt it would ever go over 50%. But that's still a big number, and between that and all the other crap going on, we'll see 50 or 60 per cent of the nation's children living apart from their biological fathers. I don't think that's ever been done in human history before, except in cultures where they never got around to installing running water. It might work, but it smells like something that probably won't. I think at least one reasonably-successful culture would have arrived at the 21st century with some alternate-parenting arrangement if any of them worked. But I don't see even one out there that doesn't use two-parent families to raise its young. It's either that or the culture is still living in the bushes.

Dear Nowhere Man:

First, I wish you the very best in your search for a good woman. They are out there, it just sometimes takes a while to find them.

Now, most folks would identify me as a "hippie," or "neo-hippie," if you prefer. I prefer non-intervention to war, am fairly liberal socially (don't infringe upon anyone else's constitutional rights, and I couldn't care less what you do), and might be seen as a "libertine" by many FReepers. Even worse, about half my wardrobe is tie-dyed.

However, I am also a very traditional young lady. I believe that marriage is a solemn promise. I believe that a man needs to be the leader of his family (else, he feels like, and becomes, less of a man), and that a good wife will submit to her husband (and that doesn't demonstrate weakness). I don't see any contradiction between having the same rights and responsibilities as any man, yet being very different from any man.

So, the moral of this story is, "Don't judge a book by its cover." :-)