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To: AndrewC
One of the things that Catholics believe is that good Jews, good Muslims, good pagans (and even good Protestants) may be saved, but it's actually easier for a pagan.

You see, a good and pious pagan, who never heard of Jesus, but believes in God, and has lived a good and Godly life, will be saved.

A Protestant can be saved if the Protestant is capable of making an act of perfect contrition, which means (gross oversimplification here) being sorry that you've sinned simply because sin is wrong, not because you're afraid of going to Hell. If you are not capable of making an act of perfect contrition, then you can only obtain forgiveness through the Sacrament of Confession.

So, as a Catholic I believe in Jesus Christ, but I accept that good pagans, good Jews, good Muslims, and even good Protestants who seek God with a true heart will be saved.

"'Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council [Vatican II] teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse to enter it or to remain in it. (Lumen Gentium 14)'

. . . .

"'Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience-those too may achieve eternal salvation.' (Lumen Gentium 16)"
http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html
4,167 posted on 07/18/2003 8:51:58 AM PDT by CobaltBlue (Never voted for a Democrat in my life.)
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To: CobaltBlue
You see, a good and pious pagan, who never heard of Jesus, but believes in God, and has lived a good and Godly life, will be saved.

How do you square that with--->

Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

You seem to be saying a good Wiccan does not need a Savior.

4,169 posted on 07/18/2003 8:59:24 AM PDT by AndrewC
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To: CobaltBlue; f.Christian
"'Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council [Vatican II] teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church........

So interjecting "tradition" is ok? ....even though it contradicts the Bible? Why? Because it suits the Church? This is even done in God's name. With all due respect, how can you justify such a thing?

Don't you see that "traditions" are created by fallible men? Men carry agendas.

4,214 posted on 07/18/2003 11:31:13 AM PDT by conservababeJen (http://abortiondebate.org/forums)
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