Cosmology: The Origin and Evolution of Cosmic Structure , Second edition
Posted on 05/11/2003 4:38:14 PM PDT by Junior
Despite movements across the nation to teach creationism in public schools, a science historian said Monday that Christians haven't always used a literal interpretation of the Bible to explain the world's origins.
"For them, the Bible is mostly to teach a religious lesson," said Ernan McMullin of the earliest Christian scholars.
McMullin spoke to a crowd of about 60 people at Montana State University on "Evolution as a Christian theme."
McMullin, a professor at the University of Notre Dame and a Catholic priest, is recognized one of the world's leading science historians and philosophers, according to MSU.
He has written about Galileo, Issac Newton, the concept of matter and, of course, evolution.
It's a subject has been hotly debated ever since Charles Darwin first published "On the Origins of Species" in 1859.
Christian fundamentalists have long pushed the nation's public schools to teach creationism as an alternative, which in its strictest form claims that the world was created in six days, as stated in the Bible's Old Testament Book of Genesis.
But McMullin said creationism largely is an American phenomenon. Other countries simply don't have major creationist movements, leading him to ask: "What makes it in the U.S. ... such an issue (over) evolution and Christian belief?"
The answer probably lies in the nation's history, with the settlement by religious groups, he said. Also, public education and religion are more intertwined here than other countries.
McMullin discussed how Christians have tried to explain their origins over the past 2,000 years, using several examples to show that many viewed Genesis as more of a religious lesson than an exact record of what happened.
It wasn't until the Protestant Reformation of the 16th Century that Genesis started to be taken literally. Then theologians started using nature - and its many complexities - as proof of creation.
Charles Darwin spoiled that through his theory of natural selection, and the battle lines have been drawn ever since.
"It replaced an older view that had sounded like a strong argument for the existence of God," McMullin said.
Par for the course.
I am going to type slowly this time – maybe it will sink in.
Evolution is presented as cosmological theory (although it is not a very good one). abiogenesis is a possible way to make Evolution a cosmological theory. Basically Evolution as a cosmological theory is the theory of happenstance – the universe just happened – no design, no intelligence.
Therefore it would be a debate on cosmology and or abiogenesis.
Once again - you really don't understand cosmology. Cosmology is the study of the universe in totality (including but not limited to the origin). Abiogenesis and evolution are both part of cosmology. Cosmology theories are basically soup-to-nuts theories of the universe (from origin till now and beyond – the universe in totality). That is why when some of you screamed “evolution has nothing to do with cosmology” – you might as well have been screaming “come look at me, I am stupid”
It would be more of a theological discussion then a scientific one at this point I am afraid.
So in your mind all cosmological theories are theological. Are you saying the only possible explanation for the creation of the universe is god? (that was a strange twist)
You said it. You twist things strangely.
Would you like to back that up with supporting evidence - or are you yet another weasel?
Name another god to whom a faith which worships him/her/it ascribes an "evolutionary" process based in the tenets of Darwinian evolution for the origins of life on this planet.
If it is within your ability to do so, you can also remind yourself that the context of this particular discussion is "theism" and "theistic evolution," being discussed as matter of Christianity, where in fact it is a matter of contradiction.
If, as a pan-theist, pagan, or possibly even an agnostic you find that the strictures of this present discussion bother you, or are simply unfamiliar to you, you are certainly welcome to start a thread on origins that involves "deities" which are not particularly germane to the discussion at hand, and see who joins in.
The prosecution rests, your honor.
Speaking of absurd. Cosmology has nothing directly to do with evolution (it is the study of the universe in totality including the course of nature). Cosmology DOES NOT mean the "evolution of the universe" - buy a dictionary. Biology is a part of cosmology. (I am guessing you do not understand the meaning of the word totality - nor do you own a dictionary because if you did you could look it up and see how wrong you are). "Orthodox Darwinist" might be a little too close to home for you ("Methinks you do protest too much")
There is no God.
Therefore, there are no instructions from God to follow.
Therefor no one can follow God's instructions.
Since no one can follow instructions that do not exist, it can be concluded that no one will follow them, or, rather All will Not follow them.
Romans had it right, this once.
I have no faith at all. It's fun being honest.
What statement are you refering to?
What do you claim was his intent?
How do you know that was his intent? (are you another one of those mind readers?)
What do you claim was my intent?
How do you know that was my intent? (are you another one of those mind readers?)
Again, you have presented no evidence whatsoever and we are not going to just take you word on it.
It is hard to beleive somebody this ignorant of the study of cosmology would bother going on a thread like this. Dude, look up the study of cosmology - you are making a fool out of yourself
Cosmology: The Origin and Evolution of Cosmic Structure , Second edition
I'll play. Why don't you put together something summarizing your position in a logical manner, and we'll see what we can do with it?
By the way, the commonly held theory for the birth of the universe is colloquially called the Big Bang. I hope this is what you meant by "evolution as cosmology".
I know of a submarine with that motto...
Of course, you know how to read Biblical Hebrew and Koine Greek as well as Aramaic.
You don't need any Pope or any other man to translate the Bible for you, and you don't need any concordance, biblical commentary and lexicon to make sense of the Bible.
You are displaying the typical arrogance and ignorance of Catholic bashers.
But again, you are the Supreme Arbiter of Christian Orthodoxy, therefore unless I agree with your sectarian viewpoint, I'm following men and not the Holy Spirit.
Treatment of Biological Evolution, Earth History, and Cosmology in State K-12 Science Standards
By Lawrence S. Lerner, Ph.D.
Evolution, the sequence of events by which the world came to be as we see it today, is the central organizing principle of the historical sciences -- biology, geology, and cosmology. Ongoing collection of evidence concerning the details of the process, and elaboration of the theoretical structure that makes the evidence comprehensible, lie at the hub of these sciences. Scientists spend much time debating the details, but there is a consensus as to the overall picture and the basic principles.
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