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To: Quester
Your #179: Because the appearance of angels can be very different than that of man ...

The passage you chose (Revelation 10:1-2) is right along the lines I have been describing. Here is an angel coming down from heaven in ineffably great glory and brilliance, with head, face, hands, and feet, both right and left.

This is consistent with someone who lived with God before he was born, came to earth to obtain a physical body and have the learning experiences of mortality, laid that body down in death, received it again in the glorious resurrection, never to die again, and was then sent back by God as a ministering angel in power and glory.

>> So ... how is it that we have fallen from our angelic status ? I assummed that you were referring to the fall of Lucifer and his following. Was there some other fall of the angels ? Do you have any scripture (that we share in common) to support this position ?

Yes, I do.

Genesis 3:17-24
17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
20 And Adam called his wife’s name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.
21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.
22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
23 Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
Also this:

LDS Pearl of Great Price, Moses 6:47-50
47 And as Enoch spake forth the words of God, the people trembled, and could not stand in his presence.
48 And he said unto them: Because that Adam fell, we are; and by his fall came death; and we are made partakers of misery and woe.
49 Behold Satan hath come among the children of men, and tempteth them to worship him; and men have become carnal, sensual, and devilish, and are shut out from the presence of God.
50 But God hath made known unto our fathers that all men must repent.

185 posted on 01/04/2004 2:36:44 AM PST by White Mountain (By their fruits ye shall know them.)
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To: White Mountain
The passage you chose (Revelation 10:1-2) is right along the lines I have been describing. Here is an angel coming down from heaven in ineffably great glory and brilliance, with head, face, hands, and feet, both right and left.

This is consistent with someone who lived with God before he was born, came to earth to obtain a physical body and have the learning experiences of mortality, laid that body down in death, received it again in the glorious resurrection, never to die again, and was then sent back by God as a ministering angel in power and glory.


Or ... the passage describes one created as an angel, ... a creation of God separate from that of mankind, ... yet having the capability to appear to men in human form, ... even though, in this case, ... not of human stature.
Genesis 3:17-24

17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;

18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;

19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

20 And Adam called his wife’s name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.

21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.

22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

23 Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.

24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

LDS Pearl of Great Price, Moses 6:47-50

47 And as Enoch spake forth the words of God, the people trembled, and could not stand in his presence.

48 And he said unto them: Because that Adam fell, we are; and by his fall came death; and we are made partakers of misery and woe.

49 Behold Satan hath come among the children of men, and tempteth them to worship him; and men have become carnal, sensual, and devilish, and are shut out from the presence of God.

50 But God hath made known unto our fathers that all men must repent.
Both of the paasages you cite clearly speak of the fall of man, rather than the fall of angels.

There is nothing in either passage which even suggests, in any way, that it also can be seen as an angelic fall.

192 posted on 01/04/2004 5:29:21 PM PST by Quester
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