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To: BMCDA; cornelis; Diamond; Phaedrus; Alamo-Girl; beckett; Dataman; js1138; PatrickHenry; unspun
However, the ultimate hell for me is if one is doomed to exist forever and it doesn't matter whether this eternal existence takes place in an environment like traditional heaven or hell.

Perhaps the way out of this conundrum would be to suggest that we do not exist forever; but our being is eternal.

Existence is conditioned by the finitude and contingency of life as we mortal humans experience it. Frequently, the configration -- of which we are all parts, participants, and observers -- is grating on us, if not positively painful.

Being is the larger context in which we live and move and have, not only our being, as the Scriptures tell us, but also our very earthly existence. Being is larger than our earthly existence, encompassing it. Being is Truth, existence its "shadow."

When I earlier said that human existence moves in a certain range, "in the stream," but that we cannot know either our beginning or our end in this stream, what I'd hoped to suggest was a corollary to this observation: Reality -- Being -- was here before we got into the stream of existence, and it will still be here after we've left the stream.

So how does this qualify us to say we know what the stream is? Or can even find out -- using the techniques of the scientific method, which says this problem does not exist in the first place?

Arguably, what we are does not find its root in existence. What we are is ultimately rooted in being -- in potentialites of which we are yet unaware. Perhaps existence is merely the reflection of being captured within a particular time reference....

Life, BMCDA, is such a wondrous blessing. How do you justify your "ultimate hell?"

95 posted on 03/05/2003 5:50:05 PM PST by betty boop
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To: BMCDA; betty boop
And a short paraphrase is: you're sitting God's mouth and He's mulling you over.
96 posted on 03/05/2003 5:54:58 PM PST by unspun (What's the most terrorized place in America?)
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To: betty boop
Perhaps the way out of this conundrum would be to suggest that we do not exist forever; but our being is eternal.

Or, perhaps we just turn into worm food over and over again.

98 posted on 03/05/2003 6:07:55 PM PST by balrog666 (When in doubt, tell the truth. - Mark Twain)
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To: betty boop; BMCDA
Thank you so much for the deeply provocative post #95!

Being is the larger context in which we live and move and have, not only our being, as the Scriptures tell us, but also our very earthly existence. Being is larger than our earthly existence, encompassing it. Being is Truth, existence its "shadow."

Absolutely! I don’t think I could agree with you more. On personal experience, I assert that being is the spirit, which does not exist solely within space/time and does not require the body. Getting “into” the spirit is the only method of worship (John 4:24) – all of us who worship in spirit know the difference. The body is immaterial; the thought, emotion and language soar.

Eternity is being outside of the dimensions of space and time. There can be no sense of time passing in eternity, no concept of distance or size. When I am “in” the spirit, I sense being part of a great harmony. That “sense” has directed much of my research whether Scripture, Physics, Math or whatever.

As Einstein once said: Reality is an illusion, albeit a persistent one.

BMCDA, you say you do not wish to be eternal. I pray you change you mind. Perhaps you could stop for an hour and be completely still, don’t think, but just listen and see if you can “sense” being outside of your body. Nevertheless, if you wish an end, it can be granted in what is called the second death in Revelation.

105 posted on 03/05/2003 8:55:08 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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