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To: rxsid
A. Iran "making" citizens out of sovereign U.S. citizens would not be recognized internationally.

So what? Isn't it our position that what other countries say legally doesn't affect our laws?

Second, it definitely wouldn't be recognized in the U.S.

See, this is the entire problem with this debate. People don't know the law. The U.S. doesn't recognize the concept of "dual citizenship" period. All U.S. law addresses is when you are a U.S. citizen, and actions that may cause you to lose U.S. citizenship. It simply does not address the situation when another country claims you as a citizen as well. So it is impossible to be a "dual citizen" under U.S. law, because U.S. law doesn't recognize the concept period.

Furthermore, following your line, the U.S. congress could then turn around and make everyone on the planet a U.S. citizen. Those scenarios are nonsense.

Sure it could. But then, other countries likely wouldn't be stupid enough to pass a law barring anyone from holding officer who was a citizen of another country without first passing laws clarifying what would constitutie such dual citizenship. Relying on the law of other nations to define when someone is a citizen isn't a solution, but right now, that's all we'd have. We don't have such a law at all right now even defining the concept.

The "Natural Born Citizen" requirement for the Commander in Chief of the armed forces is, in part, a national security measure. No CinC born with multiple allegiances!

I agree with that as a matter of principle. But you just can't pass a law saying that you can't be a citizen of another country. It will take more than that to define dual citizenship.

363 posted on 01/27/2011 1:54:45 PM PST by Bruce Campbells Chin
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To: Bruce Campbells Chin
Your wrong. Of course the U.S. recognizes dual citizenship.

The modern day State Department rules discusses the problems associated with dual citizenship:

7 FAM 081: U.S. Policy on Dual Nationality:

(e)While recognizing the existence of dual nationality, the U.S. Government does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Dual nationality may hamper efforts by the U.S. Government to provide diplomatic and consular protection to individuals overseas. When a U.S. citizen is in the other country of their dual nationality, that country has a predominant claim on the person.

...

the U.S. Supreme Court has stated that dual nationality is a "status long recognized in the law" and that "a person may have and exercise rights of nationality in two countries and be subject to the responsibilities of both." See Kawakita v. United States, 343 U.S. 717 (1952).

http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86563.pdf
364 posted on 01/27/2011 2:01:38 PM PST by rxsid (HOW CAN A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN'S STATUS BE "GOVERNED" BY GREAT BRITAIN? - Leo Donofrio (2009))
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To: Bruce Campbells Chin
Further, regarding dual nationals:

"US State Department Services Dual Nationality

The concept of dual nationality means that a person is a citizen of two countries at the same time. Each country has its own citizenship laws based on its own policy.Persons may have dual nationality by automatic operation of different laws rather than by choice. For example, a child born in a foreign country to U.S. citizen parents may be both a U.S. citizen and a citizen of the country of birth.

A U.S. citizen may acquire foreign citizenship by marriage, or a person naturalized as a U.S. citizen may not lose the citizenship of the country of birth.U.S. law does not mention dual nationality or require a person to choose one citizenship or another. Also, a person who is automatically granted another citizenship does not risk losing U.S. citizenship. However, a person who acquires a foreign citizenship by applying for it may lose U.S. citizenship. In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship.

Intent can be shown by the person's statements or conduct.The U.S. Government recognizes that dual nationality exists but does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Claims of other countries on dual national U.S. citizens may conflict with U.S. law, and dual nationality may limit U.S. Government efforts to assist citizens abroad. The country where a dual national is located generally has a stronger claim to that person's allegiance.

However, dual nationals owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there. Most U.S. citizens, including dual nationals, must use a U.S. passport to enter and leave the United States. Dual nationals may also be required by the foreign country to use its passport to enter and leave that country. Use of the foreign passport does not endanger U.S. citizenship.Most countries permit a person to renounce or otherwise lose citizenship.

Information on losing foreign citizenship can be obtained from the foreign country's embassy and consulates in the United States. Americans can renounce U.S. citizenship in the proper form at U.S. embassies and consulates abroad."

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html

369 posted on 01/27/2011 2:07:24 PM PST by rxsid (HOW CAN A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN'S STATUS BE "GOVERNED" BY GREAT BRITAIN? - Leo Donofrio (2009))
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