Replies

Hi GG. Welcome to FR! I have read over all of your posts, and you offer an acute and very logical set of arguments! What you say I think not only has merit, strikes me a’s fitting most if not all the known pieces of the OholyO puzzle we know.

VERY well done!

May I ask, how is it that you know so much about adoptions in the state of Hawaii? Clearly you have deeper knowledge that just a reading of statutes.

A further question, if Barry chose to, could he Juliet the adoption? If he did so, it is my understanding that his records would revert to their original status, with one difference, citizenship. Now would that status be that of NBC or naturalized, or citizen? Barry’s records might still be sealed, but is there any public records disclosed or diagnosable likenthise for birth index records?

Thanks for some seriously interesting ideas. I am liking your theory even better that my own. It fits the known facts better! Excellent work!

Thanks for the welcome, and please accept my apologies for taking so long to reply. Our internet access was out of commission for 12+ hours yesterday and last night. Very frustrating - I don’t want anyone thinking their reply to my comments has been gaffed off because they’ve asked a question. The response took me by surprise; mostly I visit American Thinker, where there are outstanding and thoughtful comments - but not much commentor interaction. This place, however, is like discussion and debate around the kitchen table!

I don’t know much about adoptions in Hawaii per se. My second husband adopted my children from a previous marriage, and in the same time frame as Barry’s early childhood. Ours took place in New York State, which was likely the gold standard for adoption proceedures. One would hope other states - especially a striving-to-do-it-right brand new state such as Hawaii - would adopt the proven expertise example New York offered. Well - second thoughts about that remind me that during that same time period Hawaii was a mecca for U.S. Communists looking to become less high-profile. Famous among them was Frank Marshall Davis, who had no small influence on local Hawaiian politics, union activity, the local chapter of ‘pedophiles-R-us’, and his protege - our boy Barry.

You asked if he could have reversed the adoption. In comment #219, butterdezillion says Hawaii allows an adoption to be set aside. I had never even heard of such a proceedure. I wonder how it’s done - who has the right, whether it requires hearings, whether it can be contested, could it have been done without Lolo’s knowledge/consent etc.?

Beckwith, at #265, very logically pieces together a scenario of Obama, Sr’s 1971 Christmas visit to Hawaii as being for just that purpose: Sr adopting Barry “back”. Adding to that premise is that the boy - newly enrolled at Penahu school - was apparently Barry OBAMA all through high school.

As far as Barry’s eligibility status is concerned - what a remarkably good question!! His actual physical sire, being a British subject, meant Barry was ineligible from the gitgo. Lolo was also not a U.S. citizen, so no effect. The implications of a hypothetical - but not unlikely - situation are mind boggling: because the adopting man becomes the ‘conceiving father’, what effect does that have on the child if the bio-father was not a US citizen, but the adopting father IS a US citizen?

As to Barry’s present status, my understanding is - given the various possible scenarios - he would fall into one of the following:
> If Lolo adoption was ‘set aside’, it wouldn’t automatically revert to Barry’s original parentage. The sire gave him up, so would have to agree to ‘take him back’. It would have to involve legal consent, meaning an appearance in court, and signatures. As Beckwith suggests, this is the only reason Sr would have been in Hawaii visiting his former ‘family’ for a month. We need to keep in mind that while this visit was taking place, Stanley Ann was also visiting from Indonesia where she lived with her husband Lolo. We [or, I] know of this visit from only one source - Barry’s ‘Dreams...’ book. He gave no reason for the visit - just, oh - here comes dad, and I can hardly wait for him to leave. Whichever father was in effect, Barry was still was born to a non-citizen parent. Ineligible.

> If Barry remained Lolo’s legal son, he retained his Indonesian citizenship. To become an American citizen again, on reaching age 18 he would have to apply, pay the fees, and wait whatever the then-required time before oath-taking. He would be a naturalized citizen. Ineligible.

What it boils down to is that Natural Born Citizen means born to two US citizen parents.

The only way to logically define the term “natural born” is that the birth status is unencumbered by any possibility of other than United States’ governing influence, and that it came about by Constitutional declaration and therefore without application of statute [such as naturalization].

No matter which way they try to slice this salami - Obama’s not eligible, and no twisting or cajoling, or application of statute, can trump Article II, Section 1.

I really don’t know anything about Hawaii birth index records. In New York State, no information pertaining to a sealed adoption can be public - including the information that there even IS a sealed adoption record. Apparently Hawaii plays fast and loose with regulations - or only has regulations if their Obie-boy enacts an Executive Order.