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To: dzzrtrock
I guess you don't realize that a large percentage of illegals are here because they overstayed legal visas and refused to go home. It may well have been their intent from the beginning perhaps, but that would then be the prefered way to circumvent anything you build .

There are also boats, planes and workarounds for any barrier that has ever been built anywhere.

1,694 posted on 02/12/2005 12:42:24 AM PST by Cold Heat (What are fears but voices awry?Whispering harm where harm is not and deluding the unwary. Wordsworth)
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To: Cold Heat
To Poohbah

How would they be at risk of being put IN jail? Juries routinely refuse to convict employers.

Routinely? On which ONE case? Where do you get your "facts"? You continually post "facts" like this without a SHRED of evidence to support same.

Dit-dit-dah-dah-dit.....NEWSFLASH: This just in! Poohbah, your opinions are not "facts"

Or do you plan on declaring a "temporary" suspension of the Constitution?

One has to suspend the Constitution to enforce Federal laws? You just keep getting better and better

To ColdHeat

That is the most insane comment I have ever read on a conservative forum. Where did that come from?

The REAL world. Try and think outside the box a little. THAT is where solutions are most often found. If one can't hire people at $5 a hour because there are no $5 an hour workers available, one will hire at $6 or $7 or whatever it takes to keep the doors open. If your competition is also having to hire at $7 an hour, you both stay in business and raise prices accordingly rather than keeping prices artificially low because of "illegally" depressed wages, subsidized by taxpayers through social programs. Or are you contesting the fact that having a $5 an hour manpower pool readily available in a job that previously payed $10, drives wages down?

All the rest was not accurate either. That stuff is all ridiculous, and very much a socialist view of capitalism.

Socialism: Democratic socialists and social democrats both typically advocate at least a welfare state (this means we cover their medical, school, food stamps...)

Capitalism: A common feature in modern capitalist economies is for the State to maintain a certain degree of economic planning in order to stop huge economic fluctuations (like minimum wage, worker's comp, etc.) and additionally to give capitalist economies more longer-term aim.....Likewise, if the amount of money a person can receive on welfare (a 'socialist' program/idea being fully utilized by our invaders) nears or meets the amount they could make by working, the person will have a reduced incentive to work. And when you drive the wages down, guess what happens. The artificially low wages created by illegals take real jobs and turn them into "jobs Americans don't want" and "unemployment" unless these formerly $10 an hour employees want to live 25 to a house at $5 an hour. They then go take a job for $6 an hour from another American, a job that USED to pay $10 an hour and the ripple effect spreads

Employers refuse to relocate here, no matter the enticements, because the labor pool is too shallow in people who can run automated machines that require minimum math skills and ability to key in data, measure length and width accurately and the like. Skill sets are lacking in science, engineering and tech for the service industries that we could get if we had skills to offer.

And we are going to get this from south of the border at $5 an hour? Or do you think our our own people are going to re-train for these jos at $5 an hour, sans "bennies", since that is all the employer is willing to pay in this artifical labor black-market?

I guess you don't realize that a large percentage of illegals are here because they overstayed legal visas and refused to go home. It may well have been their intent from the beginning perhaps, but that would then be the prefered way to circumvent anything you build .

1,000,000 a year by sea? Not likely. If we didn't have to run willy-nilly all over 150,000 Sq. miles of desert it would be much easier to focus more on ports and seaborn points of access. There are an estimated 4.5 mil here who have come here legally and overstayed their visas. That is out of an estimated 20,000,000-28,000,000. So 1 in 5 or 6 is here on an overstayed visa, most of whom would be SKILLED labor or "students", meaning NOT the average 3rd grade "educations" pouring over our southern border. WHAT does this have to do with keeping a large portion of that 1,000,000 a year NEW UNSKILLED ones from coming in? Does this mean that since some number has overstayed their visas we should just give up?

1,738 posted on 02/12/2005 2:05:17 AM PST by dzzrtrock ("If you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat" (Ronaldus Magnus))
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