And just how would you know this unless you frequented Stormfront's site?
Posted on 02/11/2005 10:55:36 AM PST by Jim Robinson
The shot heard around the Internet has been fired on FreeRepublic.com The owner Jim Robinson and his moderators have launched a sniper style purge against members that disagree with the President’s ‘guest worker’ amnesty or support more control of illegal immigration. Free Republic is an amazing tool for those looking for a good debate and news from around the country.
The problem for the administration of the site is that their creation is allowing the participants to learn that the Bush immigration record and plans are shockingly out of line with the views of most conservatives. The management’s answer to this conflict between the majority of conservatives and the influence of the White House on their Web site has become electronic executions and censorship.
Members and readers of Free Republic would be surprised to know that many members of their community have fallen silent on the discussions about illegal immigration lately because free speech is an illusion on FR.com. They are silent because they have been banned from the Web site without warning, cause, or explanation in most cases. For weeks the moderators have been suspending and banning new members that chimed in quickly on the immigration debates.
Now this trend has broadened as the first groups of long-term users were suspended or banned this past week. Although Robinson and his staff removed many members of the Free Republic community in the first few days of the purge, those that religiously support President Bush’s immigration plan, open borders and approve of public benefits for illegal aliens remain on the forum. Those that were banned were the members that wanted more done to control illegal immigration and a strict observance to the President’s Oath of Office.
First off, I've become a hardliner on Illegal Immigration since 9/11 and while I think sometimes the trigger is fired two quick on zots, Jim Robinson has been more than fair to me in my own 6 year experience here. I've had stuff pulled before myself. It happens.
Mr. Gheen is a respected member of the NC GOP
Now, why would one or two politicians (and your writing style sounds like a politician's letter or column) get so fired up about a web site's zot? I'm sure Mr. Gheen has more important things to worry about than being zotted from a website. However, he runs an advocacy group (which was his screenname) and website and can gain a sizable base from it, much like how I had a decent Pro-2a base back during the Concealed carry fight in Michigan. Mr. Gheen need hits and $$$ and a base. I can't blame him. I'd do the same thing if I was in his shoes.
There's a schism here between die hard Bush backers and those irked over his immigration policies. It's splitting the party and shows here on FR. Add the O'Malley press. "Strike when the iron is hot". The initial hit is starting to die down here. So Mr. Jericho registers on February 14 to stir things up a bit, much like I registered under a different name when I had my battles with some internal politics with a different site. It's not a new tactic.
Thanks to all the press, ALIPAC has it's own FR section now to keep the fires going.
All in all, this was simply a smart business decision from Mr. Gheen at the expense of FR. He can thank me later for mentioning his site name in this post. More advertisement.
In all actuality, I wish ALIPAC the best. I agree with many of the goals in their mission. I do not approve of the tactic used of tearing down this website for business reasons however, must as I disapprove of the race baiting against many who so not support illegal immigration.
And just how would you know this unless you frequented Stormfront's site?
I agree with you on most of your points. I just disagree(d) with your post above that was defending the article itself, or anyone's *knowingly* posting it.
(I'm a she, btw... and I'm in the middle of something here, so I hope that made sense. lol)
((((PING)))) for echo...((((PING))))...((((PING))))...
The moderator did a google search and found that ALIPAC's site also promotes VDARE and Rense, etc, (who also carried the Woolridge/Chittum article along with stormfront) and decided at that point to pull the thread.
Google alipac vdare
I came in later and reviewed the moderator action and decided to google a little further:
Google site:stormfront.org alipac
When I discovered that the stormfronters were involved in Ranch Rescue and Minuteman, which ALIPAC was promoting, I decided there were too many connections between ALIPAC and sites and or people with whom I wish not to be associated, and so revoked his FR posting privileges.
I did not respond to ALIPAC's letter or requests for explanation and or debate, etc, because it's none of my business who he associates with or carries on his site. I just don't want it here on FR.
Now he's decided to declare war against FR. Well, whatever. He can take his best shot. It will not change my mind about staying clear of stormfront or anti-America tinfoil hat conspiracy sites. None of that crap is welcome on FR.
Thanks all the same.
BTTT to you both.
Earlier discussion in this thread with Mr. Robinson.
Mr. Robinson:
I do not believe Gheen has declared "War" on you or Free Republic. His forum posts at his site IMO depict this conflict as an "unfortunate" event "necessitated" by your actions which he and many others perceive as a manipulation of the debate on immigration at Free Republic. I hope that things are not at that level.
Once again, Free Republic will continue to have new members that do not know the history or background that you do on some authors and groups. Without a defined and accessible list of prohibited sites, groups, and authors, you will continue to have to pull threads from well intentioned users. Pulling these threads, assuming those that post them are "storm front infiltrators" and banning accounts without explanation will probably lead to more tensions in the future.
Considering the rising interest in this issue, I constructively encourage you to take the young Turks and hot bloods with a paternal grain of salt. There is a rising anger in this nation over the illegal immigration problem and many of the people that come here will not be the extremists you have dealt with in the past although they may be very passionate in their views. Besides, would Free Republic be all that interesting without a few good knock down drag out debates from time to time?
It's a shame that some people are so into anti-immigration issues that they willfully fall in with stormfront and other white nationalist type groups. This will only make it that much more difficult in the long run to pass a political solution regarding illegal immigration.
Same can be said for the rampant Bush haters that fall for every tinfoil hat anti-America propaganda piece that comes down the pike. And when you combine the two, wow, what a mess. VDARE, Rense, Woolridge, Sam Francis, Etherzone, infowars, whatreallyhappened, antiwar, NewsWithViews, LibertyPost, LibertyForum, stormfront, libertylobby etc, etc, all prime examples.
The problem with Bush and immigration is that most conservatives are having a serious crisis over this issue. They can't understand why his immigration policies are so out of line with conservative views. As for tinfoil hats, once people look into this issue and see how out of control the situation is and how our laws are not being enforced then people will try to speculate or find a reason why. There is no logical or rational explanation as to why the administration is practically encouraging people to cross our borders illegally by the thousands each day. This situation is not only at odds with the public will but it is at odds with our national security goals. Unless you are armed with a good explanation as to why the administration is passing stricter laws like the Patriot Act while at the same time leaving us wide open with a catch and release program on the Southern border then I would go easy on the 'tin foil' hat label. Of course members of Free Republic will be struggling with this duplicitous policy because most Freepers are populist conservatives. Throwing conservatives out that disagree with Bush or putting labels on people like liberals do will only exacerbate the problem.
The best solution is not to reduce opposition by throwing people out and labeling them nuts or racists. The best solution is for Bush to listen to the people that elected him and adjust his policies and positions accordingly.
My stomach turns just by reading the titles of these sites and/or people.
Whatever. You run your website as you see fit and I'll run mine. And as I said before, I will continue removing racist and tinfoil hat materials from FR whenever I see it, and will continue removing disruptive people and or posters who cannot seem to avoid what we do not want here.
Now I've got other things to do, so this will be goodbye to you, sir.
Jim out.
I agree with everything you just said.
But if one really cares about the issue, wouldn't it be wise to do everything in your power to, not only distance oneself from, but go out of their way to *denounce* the Stormfront ideology?
I can see how one might unwittingly post an article from a source that didn't research the background of their articles.
And if I made that mistake, yes, I'd want to defend myself and complain if I weren't given the chance. But in the process of defending myself, I'd be making my case all over the place about my contempt for bigots.
(I sure wouldn't attempt to paint the slight as though it were simply a disagreement over the subject of immigration. I'd just say I had no idea of the connections and wish I'd been given a chance to explain *and* repudiate them.)
Your focusing on being Gheen's being unfairly accused without actually condemning the real bigotry, and especially your comment about "author that once showed up at a Stormfront event in the past to promote his book" gives even me pause.
It wouldn't be hard to remedy. Just as the "Minuteman Project" could easily help itself out by unequivocally stating in bold that Stormfront types are absolutely reviled and unwelcome.
Anyway, I'll probably regret posting this, lol. I usually do regret these wee-hour postings. Oh well.
Of course members of Free Republic will be struggling with this duplicitous policy because most Freepers are populist conservatives.
You are completely clueless.
Perfect question. I'll be watching for the response, too.
What about "undocumented workers" with career jobs? That is, good paying jobs held by undocumented workers for several years? They own homes, have families, etc. I know that it happens.
Are Americans going to be asked if they want those good-paying, responsible jobs "undocumented workers" have held for years? I thought Americans had to refuse the jobs first then the search for 'willing workers' began.
The "guest worker" plan may be fine for temporary work but what about "undocumented workers" who have careers? Would guest worker proponents have the "guest worker" plan renege on the promise to ask Americans first?
WofC great questions. I also notice no replies.
In case I missed it on this thread, what was your previous screen name here at FR? It helps to put commentary into perspective when I can recall a previous poster. Your commentary indicates you are not a newbie.
You might try reading some of the articles on these websites instead of only the titles. You might learn something.
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