[HarleyD]

Fair enough.

[Buggman]

If I can make another observation, in many ways this is really an argument over whether the glass is half-empty or half-full.

One could rightly say that from God's eternal, out-of-time perspective, our election is predetermined, since to God all time is already laid out and there are no surprises (which again is why the Bible says that His predestination is based on His foreknowledge). But from the human POV (which God also takes from time-to-time, interestingly enough), the one we operate in and make decisions in, the future is yet open, and we have choices to make. From the Bible, one can see both views presented.

To overemphasize either, without recognizing that both are true, is IMHO the real problem the theologians have in dealing with this issue rightly.