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To: Maximilian; ninenot; GirlShortstop
Max: I don't excommunicate anybody. That's the pope's job. He did Marcel et al. Hopefully, he will extend the list. Like you, I can think of additional appropriate targets for that power.

I am not hibernating. I am just terribly bored by the persistance of the schismatic few in following their excommunicated little cadre of defiant leaders and their rejection of papal authority. I do have a life to live and I have contributed plenty of precious time to opposing the schism. I will no doubt contribute more. It does, however come as a relief to pass the baton to the other actual Catholics here to deal with the schism.

I have the Roman and actual (not the Econian and counterfeit) Catholic Faith in communion with Rome and the pope, have hope in the ecclesiastical sense but there is no reason to hope that schism will not be schism (A is A) but rather hope that it will be luxuriously punished as it should be, and charity does not require dishonesty. The schism is what it is. Its excommunicated fraud/bishops are who and what they are, dead or alive. Its adherent schismatics are what they are. There is such a thing as objective reality.

293 posted on 07/13/2004 1:18:35 PM PDT by BlackElk (Dean of Discipline of the Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Club)
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To: BlackElk
I have the Roman and actual (not the Econian and counterfeit) Catholic Faith in communion with Rome and the pope

I'm sure that is what we all wish for. So in that case, do you believe that Jews need to convert to Christ in order to be saved, or do you believe (along with Rome and the pope) that they have their own covenant which is salvific for them? Since you tell us that there is no conflict between the "actual Catholic faith" and "communion with Rome," then you are happy to accept the doctrine that Jews can be saved through the Old Covenant? In fact, to follow the logic of Rome, they can be saved with no covenant at all, either old or new, since most Jews are atheists but Rome says that they are just fine the way they are. I hope you can explain why you see no contradiction here between Rome and the Faith.

318 posted on 07/13/2004 2:10:34 PM PDT by Maximilian
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To: BlackElk
I have the Roman and actual (not the Econian and counterfeit) Catholic Faith in communion with Rome and the pope

I'm sure that is what we all wish for. So in that case, do you believe that Jews need to convert to Christ in order to be saved, or do you believe (along with Rome and the pope) that they have their own covenant which is salvific for them? Since you tell us that there is no conflict between the "actual Catholic faith" and "communion with Rome," then you are happy to accept the doctrine that Jews can be saved through the Old Covenant? In fact, to follow the logic of Rome, they can be saved with no covenant at all, either old or new, since most Jews are atheists but Rome says that they are just fine the way they are. I hope you can explain why you see no contradiction here between Rome and the Faith.

320 posted on 07/13/2004 2:12:03 PM PDT by Maximilian
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