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I understand "emergent properties" from my perspective, which is perhaps an oversimplified one. I know when I add a component to achieve a certain purpose, I may suddenly discover that other things are now possible that I hadn't originally intended. Serendipity is an important part of the process, as is the step by step; each step making the next one possible.

I don't get too wrapped up in the debates about evolution for that reason. In my world, evolution is an important part of the design process. And the "holy grail" would be to develop a system that could itself adapt to changing circumstances. There are people working on those kinds of systems; if they manage to do it, that would be a clever piece of design, I don't think anyone would say that, now that the system can adapt itself, that there is no evidence of intelligence. Really, the more adaptable, the more clever a design it is in my world.

I can't get past the firmware at the heart of every cell. And I can't simply dismiss a brain and a nervous system as a computer made of meat. I know it is that, but a computer has an operating system and an internal control system that allows it to function; without that its just meat. So I can't help but look at a brain and see something much more cleverly put together than anything I can do, although we are getting there. We are starting to figure it out, mind you, we are figuring out which parts handle which functions and where to intervene if we want to modify it. But as we learn these things about it, as the mystery yields, my admiration for its ingenuity increases.

And I can't simply dismiss a brain and a nervous system as a computer made of meat. I know it is that, but a computer has an operating system and an internal control system that allows it to function; without that its just meat. So I can't help but look at a brain and see something much more cleverly put together than anything I can do, although we are getting there.

Certainly, the brain, and the mind, and consciousness, are among the most challenging topics I can imagine. At this stage, such problems seem almost unsolvable. But not entirely. I see no reason to think that, in principle, the whole business won't eventually yield to scientific inquiry. Most definitely I see no justification for abandoning all rational inquiry and then to go wandering off into the untestable, unverifiable realms of mysticsm. Science has a great track record. Nature can be understood. But it can sometimes take a long time.

But as we learn these things about it, as the mystery yields, my admiration for its ingenuity increases.

marron, I feel the same way. The more I learn, the more my wonder increases -- and the more I appreciate how very little I really do know, compared to what there is to know.... Thank you so very much for your two beautiful, elegant posts....