Is Free Republic a Failure?

vanity ^ | July 6, 2002 | B. A. Conservative

[ganesha]

This decision is a classic example of judicial activism. The court is saying that because burglary and tearing down fences, which are illegal because they destroy or take private property without the consent of the owner are illegal, and also immoral, therefore charging someone to look at a painting of a naked lady is also immoral and should therefore be illegal. They also attempt to make an argument that anything done in secret must be bad. Their argument is a non sequiter. It's like saying that tomatoes are red and fire engines are red , therefore all tomatoes are fire engines. The people chose to pay their own money to look at a picture. The judges thought the picture was immoral, that's their opinion but whose rights are being violated? The fact that they then base their decision on a vague reference to common law without giving anything specific as a precedent is similar to the liberal supreme court tactic of using "penumbras" and "emmanations" rather than what the law actually says.

[Tuor]

Libertarians Endorse Homosexuality, Abortion, Sex Outside of Wedlock, Drug Use, Pornography, Blasphemy, Prostitution, Gambling.

You just don't get it, do you? We don't *endorse* these things, we simply think that it isn't for government, especially the Federal Government, to involve itself in such matters. Liberals, on the other hand, *do* tend to endorse and approve of many of those things.

Tuor

Give me liberty or give me death.

[Tuor]

You talk big and bad, but you can't change the fact that you would be prosecuted for fornication in several states.

Really? Do you honestly think any of these states would actually prosecute someone based on fornication laws? If so... well, I think that ends our discussion.

Tuor

Give me liberty or give me death.

[185JHP]

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. If I knew of a better site, I'd spend a lot of time there. A few days ago someone posted a line from an old movie - I've paraphrased it for my own use as follows: "Many things aren't what they appear. But everything is exactly what it is." FR is kinda like a talkshow guy who I won't name - some good information, some fun, and sometimes inanity creeps in. FReegards

[B. A. Conservative]

"Part of the problem is that Free Republic has been infiltrated by leftists (Libertarians) who support blasphemy, drug use, homosexuality, abortion, fornication, adultery, prostitution, immorality, and a host of other things that All true conservative despise and hate."

Libertarians are not leftists. And libertarians are correct in their positions on drugs and correct in their opposition to using the power of government to legislate morality. It is you, my father, Rush and his brother who are out of touch with reality on these questions. The debate is exactly analogous to the war on poverty. The war on drugs cannot be won. It is a waste of resources. And it fosters untold political and official corruption. And thinking conservatives should know that government cannot be entrusted with serious efforts or responsibilities. And in particular the state cannot be trusted with the kinds of power that would be required if society were actually determined to abolish drug use or crimes of immorality.

If you can't stop your kids from using drugs, what kind of fool thinks the state can? If you can't stop your daughter, sister, or wife from becoming a prostitute, how would you suggest that the state accomplish this task?

You rant about blasphemy and adultery. I would ask if God can't prevent these acts, how are you or the state going to prevent them? Perhaps if the state were not coerced into wasting resources against moral turpitudes, it could actually have a greater impact on violent crimes.

[philman_36]

You talk big and bad, but you can't change the fact that you would be prosecuted for fornication in several states.
If homosexual acts aren't prosecuted in those "several states" why would fornication be any different?
Are you saying some laws are more equal than others?

[LowOiL]

The citation you have given is from a time long past, dead and gone and never to come again in our lifetimes, and probably not in the lifetimes of any now living, if ever.

Like the constitution? (using your reasoning of course)

If the ruling was unconstitutional, don't you think the supreme court would of overturned it?

Perhaps it is wise to not suggest it was a dated ruling.

[philman_36]

You can be what ever other kind of "freak" you want to be, but I can assure you, the top slot has already been taken.
Heeey...If you're going to talk about me you should at least flag me. {;^)

[anniegetyourgun]

You'll excuse me if I tire of all the navel-gazing that goes on around here......

[LowOiL]

you should at least flag me. {;^)

LOL, opps sorry....

[philman_36]

You're good at citing court cases. When was the last case for either fornication or a homosexual act?

[B. A. Conservative]

I did not mean to be critical of activism or denigrate the efforts of those engaged in those efforts. Nor am I impugning the thinking behind them. However, I am suggesting that if our focus is only on defeating liberal Democrats and causing them grief, that we have lost our perspective of the real goal which is to roll back the unconstitutional provisions that they enacted and that are now being enforced by both parties and are being unchallenged regardless of who is in power. Electing Republicans by defeating Democrats and having Republicans enact the Democratic agenda is a hollow victory.

And requesting that Republicans do the right thing in opposition to doing what is politically popular is not only humiliating but borders on infuriating.

After the 1994 Republican Revolution, Congressional Republicans did an admirable job until Bob Dole fumbled the ball in the Senate on the balanced budget amendment. Nominating Dole in 1996 was a tragic mistake and it has been downhill ever since. True conservatives should be enraged about the performance of Congressional Republicans since 1996. I would argue that re-electing left-leaning Republicans or Republicans that have under-performed on the conservative agenda just to defeat Democrats is losing sight of the ball. Conservatives need to demand more from Republicans and we should expect acceptable performance. If we don't expect and demand more from Republicans, the evidence is clear; we will not get enactment of our agenda and we will not see a repeal of the socialistic programs enacted by Democrats.

[philman_36]

I am an LEO.
And?
In fact The last Sodomy conviction here, (I think it was a year or two ago) landed the guy in prison for 3 years.
An LEO who doesn't know? Don't they give ya'll updates?
And sodomy isn't quite fornication is it. Aren't there seperate "laws" for each seperate act?

[BluesDuke]

After the 1994 Republican Revolution, Congressional Republicans did an admirable job until Bob Dole fumbled the ball in the Senate on the balanced budget amendment.

The fumbling actually began with the 1995-96 farm bill - the one Newt Gingrich so sanctimoniously called the "Freedom to Farm Act," but a) restored a passel of unwarranted farm subsidies/supports that had expired by law before the bill finally came up to pass, and b) was nothing much else if not the freedom to farm pork - and I don't mean the kind slopping on Ma and Pa Kettle's sty trough, either. Those who want to know how Republicans blew their 1994 mandate and garnered a well-deserved reputation for talking the talk but not walking the walk can begin there. (By the way, for anyone who might care to ask you, you can tell them the 1998 loss of Republican seats had nothing to do with the Clinton impeachment and everything to do with yet another budget that was hiking spending - only since the increase that finally passed was a little less than first proposed, they had the nerve to call it a spending cut, with enough people dumb enough to believe it - and Newtie and his Blowfish telling the recalcitrants looking to knock it off and get back to cutting spending, well, I'm-fed-up-with-you-clowns-who-won't-see-the-Beeg-Picture...thus prompted the rumbling that ended with Gingrich out on his big fat ass and the accelerated indecision that has since characterised the Capitol Hill leadership.)

The road to Damnocratic hell is paved with Republican't good intentions.

[Nick Danger]

If we don't expect and demand more from Republicans, the evidence is clear; we will not get enactment of our agenda

We cannot do that by yelling at them, or by yelling more loudly. We can only do that by persuading enough of our fellow voters to agree with us.

Politicians can count. We can't yell them into believing that there is some huge constituency out here for more conservative politics. They will believe it when they see more conservative candidates winning elections, and not a day before.

We often criticise the New York media for operating inside an echo chamber full of Manhattan liberals. Let's not do the same thing to ourselves. We are right wing nuts. There are not enough of us to elect anybody. The politicians know this, and that is why they throw us a bone every so often, but generally ignore us. That won't change until there are more of us. Criticizing politicians for going where the votes are is silly.

We need to stop worrying about what "the GOP" is doing and work on the voters. When we have the politicians by the votes, their hearts and minds will follow.

[B. A. Conservative]

Very well said, but I hope your analysis is flawed. I think there are still many of us who understand why the United States became great. I think there are still many in Congress who know. But I think many of them have shelved their values and adopted a defeatist attitude because of the pervasive propaganda bombardment by the media and their slanted polling data. When Newt lost his place of honor and the Republican leadership in the House collapsed, the rest of the Congressional Republicans seem to have mentally resigned. Lott was an effective barricade to conservative action while the Senate was in Republican hands.

Our job is restore the faith of Republicans in Congress that there are still many conservative Americans who have a clear perception of right and wrong. And those same representatives need to know that we are going to demand that they fight for conservative legislation to repeal socialism. And conservatives all across the country need to know that if existing Republicans do not or will not perform, they will be replaced by somebody that will deliver.

[jodorowsky]

Yeah, just like Vince Foster committed suicide because the Wall Street Journal said mean things.

[BluesDuke]

Politicians can count.

If they could count, we wouldn't have governments spending dollars they haven't yet filched (from us!) in such a way as to make drunken sailors look like A.A. chapter leaders. ;)

[philman_36]

If we don't expect and demand more from Republicans, the evidence is clear; we will not get enactment of our agenda and we will not see a repeal of the socialistic programs enacted by Democrats.
LOL...yu won fune gi.
See, personally I don't "expect" anything from Republicans or Democrats other than what has already been dished up for the last...oh, say 50-60 years, or longer. And that ain't "expecting much".
Demand something from the Republicans or Democrats? Please tell me you're kidding.
They don't hear no stinking demands. They don't even hear pleas to do what is right. What makes you think they'll listen to demands?
There ought not be either Republicans or Democrats to start with. That's just how things are today. My how far we've come in so short a time.
As far as I'm concerned the best outcome that I can see is giving both sides enough of their own rope. They'll jump the stump of their own accord.

[philman_36]

We can only do that by persuading enough of our fellow voters to agree with us.
"Every vote counts." Go Democracy! /sarcasm

Your democracy, not mine.
I still contend your "vote" is worthless.
And "agree" on what? That one party and their agenda is "better" than the other? I don't think so.
Momma didn't raise no fool!
All you've got left then is the lesser of two evils.
Principals are gone and agendas reign supreme.