I believe it was AL GORE who claimed to have written this.

i am not totally against hate crime legislation though, and let me tell you what i'm thinking. (i've been dying to actually talk to someone about this topic). i totally think whoever kills anyone with malice etc. should just get the death penalty etc. regardless of who they kill. (for instance, i think in my state they keep trying to make it a death penalty crime if you kill a cop, or a kid--well too bad. i want the death penalty for them if they kill me also).....but hate crimes legislation also applies to assault. for instance, here are two very different scenarios: if you and i are walking down the street, i bump into you, so we exchange words, and then we fight, vs the scenario, me and a bunch of my black friends decide we are going to go out as a gang and pick out an unknown single white assailant, and beat the crap out of them because they are white. my understanding is that without hate crime legislation, all of the perpetrators, of these two scenarios, the bumpers into, and the gang, would receive the same charge:assault, or aggravated assault etc. i just think it is two very different things. perhaps if we had "premeditated assault", vs hate crime legislation, that would cover it. interested to hear what you think
stell

Nothing is simple, that is for sure. I am all for the death penalty in theory, but have some real issues with how it is practiced in the U.S. Why does justice take soooo long? We, the average tax payer, has to pay for 10-20 years of death-row care, lawyers, judges, food, guards, doctors and more lawyers for some murder'n trash before justice is finally served. That bugs me. A lot. I think I'd rather have the convicted murderer just go to jail with no (zero, 0) chance of ever getting out, then live for decades in the court system. I agree with your point that killing a cop is just as bad as killing me or you and the punishment should be the same.

As to your point about "motive" ie: hate crime. While I agree that some motives are worse than others, I'm not ready to sign up for more laws to put 'extra' punishment into what amounts to the same crime. To use your example, if you and some black friends beat the crap out of me because I'm white, then I and some of my white friends find and beat you because you beat on me, which is worse? In this example, my motive may be less evil, but our actions are the same. When we start judging the motives things get a little fuzzy. When we rely on the justice system to judge motives, then it gets scary.

The flip side to this, is that I really am a white guy and have no experience with being black, hispanic, asian or a woman. I've got a couple of black friends and one buddy in particular is close enough that we have talked about a few of his experiences. (very interesting perspective on the Rev. JJ!) He has a white wife and when we've been out, I've seen a few of the looks they get from some people. I guess things take time. Another generation and I think having 1 white and 1 non-white parent will be the norm in this country. I guess I say all that to say that if one specific group can truly demostrate that they are being treated worse because of their skin color, well, then perhaps some extra 'protection' is needed. I'm just not sure that this protection means additional punishment for the offender.

Anyway, that is my nickels worth, for what its worth. Thanks for asking! I love to chew on this stuff! <|8^) mp

This is the original thread by bootyist-monk.

Yeah right... I'm still convinced that Elvis wrote it first...

Pup, you hoser, you've been here for at least half a year-- you oughter know better. The first and last time I put this dang article up, I got my gutters cleaned out.

FLAME!!!

Pup, you hoser, you've been here for at least half a year-- you oughter know better. The first and last time I put this dang article up, I got my gutters cleaned out. FLAME!!!

Guilty as charged.

DAMN IT! NOT AGAIN

Here, bud, you hold him down and I'll administer the obligatory atomic wedgie...

Nothing is simple, that is for sure. I am all for the death penalty in theory, but have some real issues with how it is practiced in the U.S. Why does justice take soooo long? We, the average tax payer, has to pay for 10-20 years of death-row care, lawyers, judges, food, guards, doctors and more lawyers for some murder'n trash before justice is finally served. That bugs me. A lot. I think I'd rather have the convicted murderer just go to jail with no (zero, 0) chance of ever getting out, then live for decades in the court system. I agree with your point that killing a cop is just as bad as killing me or you and the punishment should be the same.

I just look at it like this.

A death sentance in this country is like a life sentance with option to kill. The crook isn't getting out, ever. One way or another he's going to die in prison. And if they kill him in twenty years that's probably 10-15 years less that we have to pay for when compared to true-life WPP.

Doesn't bother me that he gets 10-20 years to fight it. As a matter of fact I wouldn't have any other way. If we're going to kill the crook we'd better make damn sure that we are right and the best way to do that is to let him fight for his life in court.

BTW. I hadn't seen this in at least 6 months and it wasn't on this site. Thanks for posting.

EBUCK

There should be a disclaimer on the front page of FR stating that anyone posting "Bad American" will be cyber drawn and quarterd.

Doesn't bother me that he gets 10-20 years to fight it. As a matter of fact I wouldn't have any other way. If we're going to kill the crook we'd better make damn sure that we are right and the best way to do that is to let him fight for his life in court.

Ok, here is my deal with that: I am under the impression that one of the reasons we don't just give life in prison to murderers is the whole 'deterent' thing. If, and it is a big if, we accept that, then waiting 10 years to throw the switch turns the deterent argument into a joke. I hear you though, we do need to be sure. Tough issue.

BTW. I hadn't seen this in at least 6 months and it wasn't on this site. Thanks for posting.

Thanks EBUCK. Despite my faux-pas, the freepers were kind to me. I'm sure my eyebrows will grow back...

mp

Hate Crimes: The opposite of Love crimes. Hate Crimes are those crimes which are committed for reasons of hate rather than reasons of love. It is a very strange distinction.

The fact is that all crimes addressed by so-called hate crimes legislation are already adequately addressed by existing federal or state criminal codes.

Hate crimes are an absurd, politically-correct construct which suggests that crimes committed for reasons of ethnic or gender hatred are somehow more reprehensible than crimes that are committed for other reasons.

Why have the feds defined a special category of crime defined as a hate crime?

First and foremost, a significant motive behind federal hate crime legislation is quite obvious: A politician who supports such laws earns votes from the minority voters who are supposedly protected by such laws.

Second, the definition of certain crimes as federal hate crimes allows federal officials to intervene and interfere in local law enforcement efforts. Hate crime legislation is thus a direct assault on states' rights. The racial lobby has effectively traded off states' rights for political power.

We're anxiously awaiting the inevitable introduction of federal Love Crime legislation.

Ok, here is my deal with that: I am under the impression that one of the reasons we don't just give life in prison to murderers is the whole 'deterent' thing. If, and it is a big if, we accept that, then waiting 10 years to throw the switch turns the deterent argument into a joke. I hear you though, we do need to be sure. Tough issue.

I think it's two fold. First is deterent and second is making sure the creep never gets the chance to do it to anyone again. Deterent..At least to me a 10-20 year wait/fight then execution would deter me. Especially considering the fact that death row is basically solitary with one hour out for exercise a day. The second takes care of itself either way.

EBUCK