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Kansas Bill Would Make Gold and Silver Legal Tender in the State
Schiff Gold ^ | 21 February 2021 | MICHAEL MAHARREY

Posted on 02/22/2021 12:45:11 PM PST by amorphous

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To: Lurker
I’ll take “10 dollars”

So you would take $10 for a $10 bullion coin? That's some super genius stuff. Me being an idiot would want the gold value.

41 posted on 02/22/2021 1:46:16 PM PST by BiglyCommentary
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To: unixfox
You get no change. They apply it to your NEXT tax bill.

That sounds real exciting, overpaying your taxes for a whole year.

42 posted on 02/22/2021 1:49:43 PM PST by BiglyCommentary
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To: Lurker
I found it: make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts

It plainly says, "make", NOT ANYTHING about "accepting". I see nothing which prevents states from accepting chickens for payment of taxes, if they so desired.

See what Webster says about the definition of each...

43 posted on 02/22/2021 1:49:47 PM PST by amorphous
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To: BiglyCommentary

“So you would take $10 for a $10 bullion coin?”

If that $10 bullion were sliver and weighed 10 grams, sure. Today’s silver spot price is about $28. There are 28 grams to the ounce. 10 gram round, $10. It’s called “math”.

You also ignored this part of the Constitution: “and regulate the value thereof”.

Idiot.

L


44 posted on 02/22/2021 1:55:57 PM PST by Lurker (Peaceful coexistence with the Left is not possible. Stop pretending that it is. )
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To: amorphous

Post the entire sentence.

“make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts”

It’s plain effing English. A State can’t make a chicken a tender in payment of a debt. Maybe they could make chicken tenders, but they can’t make one a tender.

Geez...

L


45 posted on 02/22/2021 2:01:23 PM PST by Lurker (Peaceful coexistence with the Left is not possible. Stop pretending that it is. )
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To: Lurker

So the State of Kansas would have to hold a huge quantity of gold and silver coins that would have a highly fluctuating value. They would have to hedge that risk. But don’t let all that “math” confuse a genius with a plan.


46 posted on 02/22/2021 2:02:42 PM PST by BiglyCommentary
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To: Lurker

I would like those ‘hot’ with extra blue cheese please.


47 posted on 02/22/2021 2:03:35 PM PST by crosdaddy
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To: Lurker

Only two posts.

FReepers rock. Even old FReepers.

5.56mm


48 posted on 02/22/2021 2:06:47 PM PST by M Kehoe (Quid Pro Joe and the Ho ain't my president.)
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To: amorphous; All
Thank you for referencing that article amorphous. Please note that the following critique is directed at the article and not at you.

The referenced article seems to gloss over several unconstitutional things about the constitutionally undefined Federal Reserve and so-called federal banking regulations.

First, Thomas Jefferson had clarified that the delegates to the Constitutional Convention (Con-Con) had decided not to expressly constitutionally give Congress the specific power to regulate INTRAstate banking.

"It is known that the very power now proposed as a means was rejected as an end by the Convention which formed the Constitution. A proposition was made to them to authorize Congress to open canals, and an amendatory one to empower them to incorporate. But the whole was rejected, and one of the reasons for rejection urged in debate was, that then they would have a power to erect a bank, which would render the great cities, where there were prejudices and jealousies on the subject, adverse to the reception of the Constitution." —Thomas jefferson, Opinion on the Constitutionality of a National Bank, 1791.

Next, the delegates to the Constitutional Convention had given Congress the express constitutional power to regulate the value of money whether Congress wants that power or not.

"Article I, Section 8, Clause 5: To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof [emphasis added], and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;"

A related point concerning Congress's power to regulate value of money is this. Noting that ordinary legal voting citizens have aways had the specific power to elect representatives, when Congress unconstitutionally surrendered its power to regulate value of money to the constitutionally undefined, third party Federal Reserve, the following happened.

By doing so, Congress wrongly weakened the voting power of ordinary citizens to indirectly control value of money through their elected representatives.

Next, since Con-Con delegates were aware of problems with regulating the value of paper money, another significant observation about Clause 5 is that it expressly authorizes Congress to make only coin money since there is no mention of paper money in that clause.

But under the 10th Amendment (10A), the states could still use paper money as legal tender, right?

"10th Amendment: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States [hint; emphasis added], are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

W R O N G !

Con-Con delegates had also included a constitutional provision prohibiting the states from making paper money regardless of their 10A powers.

"Article I, Section 10, Clause 1: No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts [emphases added]; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility."

Corrections, insights welcome.

49 posted on 02/22/2021 2:10:30 PM PST by Amendment10
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To: amorphous

Poor Peter Schiff. His own son is a bitcoin convert, but he still keeps playing Don Quixote with his championing of gold. Does he really imagine people will transact in a modern and digital economy with gold and silver coinage?

I realize there are still goldbugs out there, but cryptocurrency has stolen their thunder and is far more realistic as the wave of the future. We share Schiff’s criticism of government-orchestrated, unbacked fiat money and how it empowers leftist totalitarian government. But in 2021 shiny rocks are not the answer.


50 posted on 02/22/2021 2:16:28 PM PST by EnderWiggin1970
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To: M Kehoe; All

I have to add something. If I go into an Infiniti
dealership, I can buy a vehicle with Bitcoin, gold or silver coins.

Or a bunch of Benjamins.

Fact.

5.56mm


51 posted on 02/22/2021 2:17:15 PM PST by M Kehoe (Quid Pro Joe and the Ho ain't my president.)
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To: EnderWiggin1970
Does he really imagine people will transact in a modern and digital economy with gold and silver coinage?

When you try to point out why we are not going back to the way it was 100 years, the gold bug types just keep posting ridiculous noise. No rational serious responses. This thread has some fine examples.

52 posted on 02/22/2021 2:29:27 PM PST by BiglyCommentary
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To: Lurker
Maybe they could make chicken tenders...

:)

A State can’t make a chicken a tender in payment of a debt.

Exactly!

States CAN'T make (or force) their citizens to ACCEPT chickens as payment of debt. Only the federal government is allowed to do that - tho I believe we're well on our way of seeing chicken nuggets worth their weight in hundred dollar bills due to hyper-inflation.

Even so, neither states nor the federal government can prohibit individuals, businesses, local governments, or even state or federal agencies from ACCEPTING other things of value for services, or exchange of value, instead of money.

This is clearly a Tenth Amendment right:

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

The distinction that must be made is MAKE, as in force, vs what is ACCEPTABLE by both parties in a transaction.

And henceforth, if "chickens" are acceptable, then any form of valuable would likewise be so, including gold and silver bullion, or whatever both parties settle upon to settle their transaction.

Ta da...

53 posted on 02/22/2021 2:31:14 PM PST by amorphous
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To: amorphous
The amount for the purchase in gold or silver would need to be posted by the vendor.
$1.00 in Federal Reserve Notes is not of equal purchasing value/power compared to $1.00 in silver dimes or quarters.
54 posted on 02/22/2021 2:35:41 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: EnderWiggin1970
Well, the bible says people in time will throw their gold and silver into the streets. :)

Worst trade I've made is trading BTC for gold. Lol.

But I do believe in diversifying assets once one has enough assets necessary for basic survival and subsistence.

Preppers, once considered the bane of carefree happiness, is now an important person in some hard hit areas of this country.

55 posted on 02/22/2021 2:40:45 PM PST by amorphous
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To: philman_36

Agree. It should be settled at current market value at the time of transaction, I would envision.


56 posted on 02/22/2021 2:42:58 PM PST by amorphous
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To: Amendment10
Corrections, insights welcome.

#53

57 posted on 02/22/2021 2:47:48 PM PST by amorphous
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To: amorphous
And I was talking a paper Note.
Federal Reserve coins are worthless and in no means
are they of equal value to their silver counterparts.
58 posted on 02/22/2021 2:47:50 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: philman_36
Ok, so if I have this right, you're talking "face value" of silver coins? I.E., a dime's "face value" is worth 10cents. Says so right on dime.

The metal content of a US Dime (for example), is based on year. Pre-1965 US coins are about 90% silver. It's fairly easy to convert their value into Fed Notes, based on the coinage, quantity, year, and current spot silver price, at a point of sale or transaction.

59 posted on 02/22/2021 2:55:24 PM PST by amorphous
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To: amorphous
Pre-1965 US coins are about 90% silver. It's fairly easy to convert their value into Fed Notes, based on the coinage, quantity, year, and current spot silver price, at a point of sale or transaction.

Yes, by silver weight. A pre-1965 dime is of far more value than a 2021 dime because of its metallic composition.

60 posted on 02/22/2021 3:02:24 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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