Cold Fusion Energy: What to Expect and How Close We Are

Foreign Policy Journal ^ | October 30, 2013 | Dr. Stoyan Sarg

[Kevmo]

Are you aware of some other LENR articles written by Dr. Sarg?

[Future Snake Eater]

We were just talking about the possibilities thats all, I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition!

[Wonder Warthog]

"....and the money machine continues crunching"

Yup, it sure does. Hot fusion funding should have been cut drastically long ago after fifty-plus years of abject failure. Cold fusion, OTOH, has long surpassed hot fusion in THE datum that matters, a COP greater than unity.

That the holder of the keys in high-energy physics have succeeded in obfuscating the real situation reflects badly on the scientific ethics of that community.

[KC_Lion]

Because their chief weapon is SURPRISE!

[woofie]

I feel a sudden surge of warmth and reassurance about the universe to see that you are still posting these threads...

[Wonder Warthog]

"If you could draw 2kw from a device using 360w, what is the fuel? We have to be losing something to get the extra draw of 1640w. It may be something so abundant that we really will never realistically care?"

There are two "schools" of LENR....the original Pd/D2 (palladium/deuterium) pioneered by Pons and Fleischmann. In that case, the fuel is simply deuterium, and the main product is He4.

The other school, Ni/H (nickel/protium) has much less research data available, and the overall reaction has not yet been elucidated. Rossi has speculated that the reaction there is Nickel adding a proton, and forming a copper nucleus.....but he has backed away somewhat from that position.

There are a lot of "low-level" reaction branches....some produce tritium, some apparently cause gamma emission, but the main heat-generating reactions in both schools seem to be aneutronic and free of high-energy gammas other than at startup.

There is also STRONG evidence of transmutation of other nuclei...the most recent of which has been reported by Mitsubishi (and replicated by Toyota) of the conversion of cesium to praesodymium by forced passage of a flux of deuterium through a solid substrate.

[Moonman62]

“more funded research is needed until the new energy source is matured for the market.”

and the money machine continues crunching

These crackpots were making fantastic energy production claims over 20 years ago. Why aren't they making their own money in the energy market, instead of asking suckers for more?

[Smokin' Joe]

That the holder of the keys in high-energy physics have succeeded in obfuscating the real situation reflects badly on the scientific ethics of that community.

No surprise. Consider the number of chemistry and physics professors who would have to re-learn their subject and you can expect even greater resistance than when Plate Tectonics came on the scene in geology and geophysics.

Besides, the high-energy guys have been looking for a death ray or a trump card weapons system, whether they know it or not. LENR is more of a civil engineering feat.

[Smokin' Joe]

Why aren't they making their own money in the energy market, instead of asking suckers for more?

Why did Tesla die broke?

Being good with ideas doesn't make you good at making money, especially if you start with relatively little of the latter.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Consider the number of chemistry and physics professors who would have to re-learn their subject and you can expect even greater resistance than when Plate Tectonics came on the scene in geology and geophysics."

Can't buy this'un. Any competent scientist has to "relearn their subject" pretty much continuously as God rubs our noses in the fact that we really know very little about how His universe works.

[Smokin' Joe]

I can. Go take a college physics class and start asking about FTL travel, or the velocity of gravity. Be ready to drop the class or flunk--regardless of how well you do on tests. I received just such a threat while inquiring about the velocity of gravity when I was a grad student.

We're not talking about finding the gene that causes brown hair, here, but a fundamental foundation shift (fundamental assumptions) on the order of discovering two plus two actually equaled 4.5 (just an example of the magnitude, not an assertion on my part).

Just as discovering a fundamental force which enabled FTL with little energy investment would overturn Relativity, there were fistfights in the aisles over Plate Tectonics vs Geosynclinal Theory. Fundamental change is met with strong resistance by those who have been taught the teachings of the status quo are gospel.

Minor advancements and refinements which are compatible with current fundamental theory are greeted (after peer review) as advancements.

Changes in the fundamental axiomatic structure of a field are resisted strenuously by those who have invested their lives in learning, researching, publishing, and teaching within the old set of axioms.

[Lx]

I can. Go take a college physics class and start asking about FTL travel, or the velocity of gravity. Be ready to drop the class or flunk--regardless of how well you do on tests. I received just such a threat while inquiring about the velocity of gravity when I was a grad student.

I can't remember when I heard or read that but someone was saying that the sun's effect on our gravity (or more probably, making a blip in our trip around the sun). That it appeared that the effects of the sun's gravity affecting Earth were quicker than it took light to make the same trip.

I wish I could remember where I read that.

[Wonder Warthog]

I can't disagree at all with the points you make about the sociology of science. They are certainly real (and I am familiar with them and the subject). But note the phrase "competent scientist" in my response. Once a science-credentialed individual succumbs to "scientific correctness", they have surrendered their credentials and become pseudo-scientists, even if not recognized as such.

I was lucky enough to have worked with one Nobel Laureate on a short project in grad school, and what impressed me the most was that he was ALWAYS questioning assumptions....his own, and others. And this was will into the twilight years of his career...he died a couple of years later.

I just wonder what Richard Feynman would have done if he had lived to see CF. Certainly his contemporary Julian Schwinger thought LENR was very real, and I think he was a bit shocked that he was actively prevented from publishing theoretical studies on the subject, despite his standing and credentials.

[Moonman62]

Tesla died broke because he was much better at inventing than finances and business, and he probably had a touch of mental illness. However, he was very rich at one time and had the backing of one of the richest men in the world. Westinghouse paid Tesla's expenses until he died.

I fail to see what Tesla has to do with the cold fusion scammers.

[Nifster]

precisely

[Wonder Warthog]

"Westinghouse paid Tesla's expenses until he died."

And he damned well should have. Tesla voluntarily gave up any and all royalties that Westinghouse was obligated to pay him in order to save Westinghouse's company and his leadership thereof.

Read "Empires of Light" by Jill Jones for an excellent and thorough treatment of the establishment in the USA of the electric power economy.

[Mr. K]

why did yu ping me to this?

I DIDN’T DO NOTHIN’! I SWEAR!

[Mr. K]

that;s what worries me about Rossi’s device

its been years now

if this is a breakthrough then what is he waiting for? does he want to become a trillionaire very slowly?

all this secrecy and only letting people test under his conditions is the part that is throwing everyone off the bandwagon on this

[KC_Lion]

"why did you ping me to this?"

LOL, Sorry I thought maybe you would be expecting the Spanish Inquisition.

[Wonder Warthog]

Here is an interesting discussion of points similar to those you make:

http://amasci.com/supress1.html