Posted on 09/13/2008 7:36:55 AM PDT by Schwarzeneger
“that many would not save the money “
So, you are a socialist in that you believe that you and government knows better and you have no trust in the people to fend for themselves. Where does the government get its money if not from the very epople who say can’t fend for themselves? It seems the government cannot fend for itself without stealing from the people.
Its my belief that the Social Security funds will not be tapped out. The powers that be can always inflate their way out it. In other words they can pay you the amount promised but the actual worth of those funds (even though they are technically indexed) will not be what was promised. In this way the SS payments will be made but the actual value of those dollars will be deflated as the economy inflates. Because of this I predict a constant ongoing pseudo-inflation, no matter who gets into office. It unavoidable. there is no free lunch. We need to follow with our commitments but we need to learn our painful lessons and not raid the funds. Also we need to stop allowing the SS funds to be used for everything and anything. it is a retirement security blanket not a an open source dipping fund.
[1] I love my country
[2] There’s a bear [and some rabid camels and pandas] in the woods.
Its an unfortunate reality we are in we are committed. And, the private sector is still available for real retirement funds. I am clearly not a socialist, but I am realistic IMO on this issue.
Hehe
yes...rabid Bear Panda and Camels out there!
“Its an unfortunate reality we are in we are committed.”
I haven’t resigned myself to believing that.
Under the US Constitution, spending bills cannot be made into the future, meaning future generations are under no obligation to pay SS. There is no contract that you could possibly take into court and demand payments. In fact, SS is nothing but a 15% additional tax that goes straight into the general fund. There is no social security trust fund and you have no account.
Our founding fathers warned us against such socialist programs for a variety of reasons that hold true today. We need to phase out SS without compromising those that have already been taxed into retirement and must rely on that very limited income.
I want to hear a candidate speak to those issues, not tell us the status quo will be maintained.
Look we are comitted to paying out those who have paid in. Defaulting on that is no solution.
Yes we could (as Bush decried) do an opt out solution but that will only become a Freddie or Fannie as people essentially complain that the private sector has lost their retirement funds. In other words the gov. will essentially have to pick up the bill anyway IMO.
The answer to me is to DEFLATE (already happening) and REFORM NOW. No more 15% into the general fund. Put the money in a real ss fund now. And pay out the funds and realize the will be deflatted for several years out until the responsible actions implemented begin to take over. It will be painful for a bit but its the only responsible solution IMO.
We sure don't need a Communist Organizer in the White House!
I have always had one simple reason that has remain unchanged: The Supreme Court.
That alone makes me terrified of President Obama.
And of course get a REAL handle on spending. The dollar is going to suffer some but as we become more stable, and implement solid reliable fiscal policies the dollar will eventually rebound. Its just like a prudent household that recovers by implementing prudent actions and discipline. They don’t default on their commitments but rather manage them given what they have before them. The DEFLATION of SS payouts in unavoidable and essentially becomes a sort of pseudo rationing, but no one is left out. It s ridiculous that our actions have gotten us here but we must responsibly get ourselves out without.
reason enough
Had a long response typed up, but my reasons boil down to: these are two extraordinary people, rarer than one in a million, and they can be trusted to always do the right thing.
It’s enough for me.
I have never been a McCain fan, but I am willing to vote against someone like Obama.
I wish I heard your long reply, and some more details, but I understand what you are saying.
Way to put your Country first Lt.
Completely agree with you.
Supreme Court—we’ve got a better chance with McCain.
I agree with what you say up to a point. I'm betting that you are not in your 6th decade, probably not even close or you wouldn't be so eager to trash SS.
Reforming the system is like changing tires on a car rolling down I94 at seventy MPH. The tough nut to crack is what do you do for the people who have been paying into the system for their entire working life and are now nearing retirement. We all realize that the "trust fund" is a sham and the currents receipts are used to pay current benefits for current retirees. We realize that we face retirement with nothing but a government IOU in hand. Hopefully we have had enough sense to invest some of our discretionary income and most will have pensions and perhaps 401Ks and 403Bs. But we have sunk a lot of money into the system and expect to see a return even if it has to come from a generation x dude's FICA tax levy.
If you just abolish the system as you suggest,you will see a march on Washington that will look like a silver wave breaking on the shore as an army of crabby old f@rts descend on the halls of power and proceed to take the place apart, brick by brick. You'll see Representatives and Senators introduced to the fine art of tar and feathers complete with a ride out of town on a split rail and that's just for openers. I expect that some might seize the Treasury and proceed to print our own d@mn money.
Not a pretty picture is it? I've heard it said that life is beautiful and death is peaceful, it's the transition that's terrible! Everyone knows that the Social Security system as it is today is not sustainable for much longer. It is a 'Ponzi scheme' and it worked fine when there were sixteen contributors for every retiree. Now we are down to two to one, soon to be one to one as the 'baby boomers' start cashing out. Succeeding generations of spineless politicians have 'kicked the can down the road' by trying incremental patchwork fixes, but no really sound answer as appeared as yet.
Just refunding the money that you have paid in would be a start although hugely unfair to those singled out for the hose job of the century. I sat down with my FICA records (available from the SS administration, if you haven't checked your yet you should as you only get three years to catch any mistakes they might make in your account!) and totaled them up from 1960 to date. The sum was not enough to be really impressive and maybe you might be able to live on it for a year or two at most. Then I applied a little math to a spreadsheet and dug out the Dow averages for the last sixty some years. The glory of compound interest and the time value of money resulted in a seven figure nest egg! How 'bout that, I could live comfortably forever on just the interest! This fact bears out your original statement about people doing better for themselves which shouldn't be a problem as SS has a rate of return around 3% and the Dow is historically in the 10% to 12% range.
It is obvious that I will not be able to live 'comfortably' on SS alone, but I do have a valid claim on about $1400 a month. The question remains how do you intend to finance that current obligation?
Regards,
GtG
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