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Anti-evolution, pro science conservatives
WorldNetDaily ^ | 3/29/2008 | Gary Bauer and Daniel Allott

Posted on 03/29/2008 6:54:19 PM PDT by wastedpotential

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To: js1138; hosepipe
When you use the word miracle, are you asserting you were singled out for survival by a specific act of God? Implying that those who didn't survive were specifically singled out to die?

I am not asserting anything, my survival is a fact. I survived situations that could have easily resulted in newspaper accounts. Implying what happened to others is not a consequence of my survival. As you stated ... "We are all going to die."

541 posted on 04/04/2008 11:40:06 AM PDT by AndrewC
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To: AndrewC
Some people simply cannot bring them selves to give God the credit for saving their bacon.
542 posted on 04/04/2008 11:46:02 AM PDT by Fichori (Truth is non-negotiable.)
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To: Fichori
Those who practiced Bloodletting did so in the name of [scientific] medicine...

Not so much: "The story of bloodletting is intertwined in the mysterious fabric of medical lore; it originated from magic and religious ceremonies....Witch doctors and sorcerers were called on to drive out the evil spirits and demons. Bloodletting was a method for cleansing the body of ill-defined impurities and excess fluid....

"Health depended on the proper balance of these humors. Bloodletting was, therefore, a method used for adjusting on of the four body humors to proper balance...."

As opposed to: "The new 'scientific' or 'experimental' medicine (where results are testable and repeatable) replaced early Western traditions of medicine, based on herbalism, the Greek "four humours" and other pre-modern theories."

Just saying it was scientific doesn't make it so.

543 posted on 04/04/2008 11:59:15 AM PDT by Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
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To: AndrewC
I posted those two images of the "same" fossil for a reason. They do not contain the same fossil pieces.

Where are those two images from, and who said they were supposed to contain the same pieces?

544 posted on 04/04/2008 12:02:32 PM PDT by Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
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To: js1138; AndrewC; betty boop; Alamo-Girl
[ When you use the word miracle, are you asserting you were singled out for survival by a specific act of God? Implying that those who didn't survive were specifically singled out to die? ]

True... after a few times you can discount being saved from certain death as "luck".. or good fortune.. but after many times you simply must consider NOBODY is THAT lucky.. You must not consider your own personal experience as everyones personal experience.. There COULD be things available you are ignorant of..

I say that in response to the tenor of your posts.. And say to myself.. Boy.. does this guy(you) have some lessons to learn.. OR (sadly) NOT.. I can appreciate your position since I have a very hard head.. I am not an easy case for the Holy Spirit.. And appreciate the longsuffering of the Holy Spirit.. WHo is very very persistent.. thankfully..

545 posted on 04/04/2008 12:07:26 PM PDT by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole....)
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To: CottShop
No sir- the responsible person says that a hell was created ror the evil one, and that if YOU choose to follow the evil one by denying God, then you will share in his just punishmenets

Where did I deny God? I said that God, as understand Him, is a lot more complex, intelligent, and creative that whatever the hell it is you worship.

Again- you seem to be of them ind set that nothign is YOUR fault- you refuse to take responsibility for YOUR own actions, and wishj to lay the blame on God when he has done EVERYTHING possible short of FORCING you to accept His word.

On the contrary. I take responsibility for my actions and I intend to answer to God for them. I accept that.

Tell Him that when You meet Him face to face and try to shovel the blame off on Him when it will have been your own choice to refuse Him. There won’t be ANY excuses available to you then sir- you wqill HAVE to own up to your own actions at that point- complaining about it here on earth, and maligning and insulting Him and htose hwo follow Him in public forums won’t dimish your OWN accountability.

On the contrary. I may insult those who think they follow God. However, I do not, unlike you, malign or defame God as a simplistic creature, but see Him as a being of such complexity that I can only begin to comprehend Him and His plans.

Lol- your whole argument against hte existence of God is based on your opinion that God must be and act in 1 0 parameters?

Incorrect. I argue that God exists and acts in much more than 1/0 parameters. The fact that your "god" acts in 1/0 parameters indicates that what you worship is not God. What you appear to worship some stick figure that, for all I know, was created by the adversary as a stumbling block for self-certain fools like you.

And if I am wrong, I can accept being wrong -- for all eternity if need be. If you're wrong, can you accept it?

Let me make one more thing clear: I believe God exists. If you write again that I deny God exists, you are a liar.

546 posted on 04/04/2008 12:14:47 PM PDT by onewhowatches
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical; CottShop
Where are those two images from, and who said they were supposed to contain the same pieces?

You don't read the links you defend?

This doesn't look familiar?

AiG lies about Ambulocetus pelvis

547 posted on 04/04/2008 12:16:44 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: hosepipe

What evidence do you have that nobody is that lucky.

And does the converse hold? Have infants who die of malaria been singled out for misfortune?


548 posted on 04/04/2008 12:37:33 PM PDT by js1138
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To: js1138
[ What evidence do you have that nobody is that lucky. ]

My experience as a poker player.. not only personal experience but observeing other players and games of chance..

549 posted on 04/04/2008 12:41:36 PM PDT by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole....)
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To: hosepipe

You win all the time at poker, or are you just making stuff up?


550 posted on 04/04/2008 12:44:25 PM PDT by js1138
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To: AndrewC
You don't read the links you defend?

No need to be a jerk. I agree that those photos do not contain the identical pieces. It looks to me like the color one has a handful more pieces than the black and white one, which from the way it's described ("there is a black and white image of the same skeleton on Dr. Thewissen’s web site that was once used instead of the above color image") is probably an earlier photo. It makes sense that the later photo would have more pieces. Also, the b&w photo seems to be an attempt to put the skeleton together as it would be in the animal, while the color photo spreads the bones out for easier inspection. And the rib bones are arranged in different orders, but they mostly seem to be the same bones. But other than those things, the only real anomaly I see is the right hip in the b&w one, which seems more complete than the color version. I don't know why that is, but it's a pretty trivial issue.

551 posted on 04/04/2008 12:52:03 PM PDT by Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
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To: js1138
[ You win all the time at poker, or are you just making stuff up? ]

No.. I lose regularly.. So far I havn't died.. Well completely died.. I did die once(electrocution), no heart beat or pulse for many minutes.. but they brought me back.. There were other times and events where luck was an extreme longshot.. i.e. a stroke, heart attack, car crashes, and other events I can't reference..

552 posted on 04/04/2008 12:53:48 PM PDT by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole....)
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To: hosepipe
So I'm going to ask you again -- the question you and AC have avoided answering -- when you refer to "miracles" do you imply that you have been singled out by God for survival? Do you attribute your survival to specific intervention by God?

And does the converse hold? Are children dying of horrible diseases being singled out for an early painful death?

553 posted on 04/04/2008 1:00:48 PM PDT by js1138
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To: js1138
[ when you refer to "miracles" do you imply that you have been singled out by God for survival? Do you attribute your survival to specific intervention by God? ]

I call miracles, miracles because I don't know what else to call them.. Maybe something else is involved.. Actually probably is.. Could be something is needed from me.. Like THIS CONVERSATION..

[ And does the converse hold? Are children dying of horrible diseases being singled out for an early painful death? ]

Your logic does not hold.. One does not result in the other.. Since no one actually DIES.. according to the Judeo christian God.. merely the flesh dies.. It could be everybody lives eternally... somewhere..

554 posted on 04/04/2008 1:12:48 PM PDT by hosepipe (CAUTION: This propaganda is laced with hyperbole....)
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
I am thoroughly convinced you selectively read my post.

I will put it very simply:
As long as you don't consider those who, practiced Bloodletting and believed it to be scientific medicine; Bloodletting was not scientific medicine.

Bloodletting was, at the time, no less scientific than Evolution is now.
They are both built on a foundation of Religious belief in unproven or unprovable ideas.


So now the only remaining question is, at the time of practice, was Bloodletting vehemently defended in the same fashion that Evolution is now.(rhetorical question)
(I think not; Evolution is much more Religious in nature.)
555 posted on 04/04/2008 1:15:15 PM PDT by Fichori (Truth is non-negotiable.)
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical; CottShop
I don't know why that is, but it's a pretty trivial issue.

I apologize for the question that disturbed you, but Sarfati and the other author have been called liars for essentially a similar action. In any case, the hip bones are the bones of contention and therefore extremely important. So they should be unquestionable. They are not.

As to the placement, foot bones should be foot bones, and tail bones should be tail bones,etc. And those bones should not change shape from image to image except in minor ways.

556 posted on 04/04/2008 1:19:59 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: hosepipe
Since no one actually DIES.. according to the Judeo christian God

Then perhaps the postponement of your heavenly bliss is a punishment.

557 posted on 04/04/2008 1:19:59 PM PDT by js1138
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To: js1138; hosepipe
So I'm going to ask you again -- the question you and AC have avoided answering -- when you refer to "miracles" do you imply that you have been singled out by God for survival?

It is courteous to address someone you criticize. In any case, the fact that someone is a recipient of special action certainly denotes selection. That selection does not imply anything about selection for something else unless the selection criteria are connected in some fashion. Your quote, which I cited, answers that.

I take it that you have never thanked God for saving your bacon, ever.(I "seem to" remember that you are not an atheist or agnostic)

558 posted on 04/04/2008 1:27:43 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: AndrewC

I will thank God for my personal well being when I can see that such favors are equally distributed. Until then I do not believe God hands out treats or meddles in the laws of nature.


559 posted on 04/04/2008 1:35:05 PM PDT by js1138
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To: Fichori
As long as you don't consider those who, practiced Bloodletting and believed it to be scientific medicine; Bloodletting was not scientific medicine. Bloodletting was, at the time, no less scientific than Evolution is now.

Like I said before, insisting doesn't make it so. Bloodletting was not scientific medicine in today's sense of "scientific," which is the only one that matters when evaluating it vis à vis evolution. The theory of evolution meets today's standards for science; the theory behind bloodletting doesn't.

560 posted on 04/04/2008 1:43:27 PM PDT by Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
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