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To: Political Junkie Too
[PJ #87] Electors in the early 19th century would not have voted for a person with non-citizen parents.

[wp #92] George Washington's father never became a citizen of the United States.

[PJ #93] Irrelevant. That's why Article II Section 1 grandfathered every citizen at ratification as eligible to be President. The Electors would have known this.

So, the electors did vote for a persons with a non-citizen parent, but that is irrelevant to your claim that "Electors in the early 19th century would not have voted for a person with non-citizen parents." Got it.

Any candidate who had a parent die prior to 1776 had a non-citizen parent. Jefferson had a non-citizen parent, and he got votes in 1800 and 1804.

The grandfather clause said nothing of the citizenship of parents. It said the candidates did not need to be natural born citizens to be eligible to the office. Nobody cared about the citizenship of parents then, or in 1880 when they voted for Chester Arthur.

That may have been what many states did for awhile (since the Constitution says the legislatures may choose the method of selecting Electors), but Hamilton wrote the following in Federalist #68:

What Hamilton anonymously wrote to the People of New York before the Constitutional Convention was just his opinion. Hamilton was the only New York delegate who did not walk out of the Convention, leaving Hamilton with no authority to represent and speak for the state of New York. That is why he signed Hamilton of New York.

Bush v. Gore, "the state legislature's power to select the manner for appointing electors is plenary; it may, if it so chooses, select the electors itself, which indeed was the manner used by state legislatures in several States for many years after the framing of our Constitution." All the states did that for 35 years with the first recorded popular vote recorded in 1824. Or, as you try to minimize it, they did it "for awhile."

The Electoral College was envisioned to be made up of trusted prominent town citizens who were not already holding public office, who would gather, discuss, debate, and then each make their choice for President, seal it, and send it off to Congress.

What was actually ratified gave plenary authority to the State legislatures; elected State officials. "Each State shall appoint, in such manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors...." Elected Federal officials could not be electors. It was not until after the 12th Amendment that the Electors cast one vote for President and one vote for Vice-President. As intended by the Framers, they cast two votes each, without specifying votes for President and Vice President.

Article 2, Sec. 3: (see Amendment 12)

The electors shall meet in their respective states, and vote by ballot for two persons, of whom one at least shall not be an inhabitant of the same state with themselves. And they shall make a list of all the persons voted for, and of the number of votes for each; which list they shall sign and certify, and transmit sealed to the seat of the government of the United States, directed to the President of the Senate. The President of the Senate shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all the certificates, and the votes shall then be counted. The person having the greatest number of votes shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of electors appointed; and if there be more than one who have such majority, and have an equal number of votes, then the House of Representatives shall immediately choose by ballot one of them for President; and if no person have a majority, then from the five highest on the list the said House shall in like manner choose the President. But in choosing the President, the votes shall be taken by States, the representation from each state having one vote; A quorum for this purpose shall consist of a member or members from two thirds of the states, and a majority of all the states shall be necessary to a choice. In every case, after the choice of the President, the person having the greatest number of votes of the electors shall be the Vice President. But if there should remain two or more who have equal votes, the Senate shall choose from them by ballot the Vice President.

The 12th Amendment cleaned up the mess made by the Framers.

Amendment XII

The electors shall meet in their respective states and vote by ballot for President and Vice-President, one of whom, at least, shall not be an inhabitant of the same state with themselves; they shall name in their ballots the person voted for as President, and in distinct ballots the person voted for as Vice-President....

Anyway, I was addressing what the Framers actually did, not what you would have preferred them to have done, or what you would prefer to change.

94 posted on 01/04/2024 6:20:30 PM PST by woodpusher
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To: woodpusher
Now your just talking smack to get your jollies.

You're just trying to find an edge case and ram a truck through it. You know the point I was making about the Electors evaluating the candidates for eligibility. The non-citizen parents wasn't an issue in 1792 and you know it.

Anyway, I was addressing what the Framers actually did

No, the Framers did what Hamilton wrote. It was the legislatures who did something else with their plenary power. And then Congress changed what the Framers wrote with the 12th amendment.

-PJ

95 posted on 01/04/2024 7:25:57 PM PST by Political Junkie Too ( * LAAP = Left-wing Activist Agitprop Press (formerly known as the MSM))
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