Posted on 12/14/2015 1:47:21 PM PST by w1n1
Can you say “truck gun” ?
Do you own a GLOCK? A 1911? Well if you do, MechTech Systems of Kalispell, Montana has a C.C.U. for you. That’s Carbine Conversion Unit and it does just that — converts your pistol into a carbine with an ATF-legal 16″ barrel, a stock, and rail space for optics and accessories. It isn’t a firearm, which means it can ship right to your door, all without changing the Federal classification of your handgun. Sounds great on paper, but does it actually work? . . .
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/12/jeremy-s/mechtech-c-c-u/
Ok. In order to shut down this conversation I’ll just say “you win”.
But I will continue to use .45 ACP and .45 Long Colt as will most of the shooting public because the shooting fraternity understands the designations. And ultimately we shall do as we d@mned well please.
Now please go away. You’re very annoying.
Aspergers or a very needy ego ...
Buffalo Head,
You came out of the gate with a chip on your shoulder using such abrasive talk as “WTF” and “Read the Headstamp Stupid”.
Later you responded to other posters with other drivel “folks that don’t have a clue” and “you need help”.
My response to you was unseemly as well by calling you “an arrogant little prick”, and for that I apologize.
But after revisiting this most excellent thread, excellent because I like knowing how my bud freepers feel about shtf fire arms and plus a little conflict makes things more interesting, one thing stands out to me;
While you like to brag about your knowledge you lack common wisdom, and you come accross like a jihadist in your fervor to belittle everybody about their “lack of knowledge”.
If you had common wisdom you would accept the fact that EVERY firearm builder from Colt Manufacturing to Springfield and all those in between who build a 1911 variant list their products as .45 ACP, not
45 Auto. Every reloading manual from Hornady’s to Nosler list the load data .45 ACP or in parentheses next to .45 Auto.
And while you are mostly correct inasmuch as headstamps are marked .45 Auto, there are still manufacturers such as IMI who headstamp their brass .45 ACP.
That being said everybody who’s been on this thread knew what ricmc2175 was talking about when he referred to a .45 ACP, fact is even You knew what he was talking about.
I’d suggest you take your private little jihad to a gun forum but I know for a fact you’d get treated like the sniveling idiot that you are in a far worse fashion. Maybe you’ve already tried it. Lol.
Anyway your “knowledge” doesn’t impress anybody here with the way you try sharing it, and I imagine if we were all at the gun club together you’d get bitch slapped for the arrogant little prick that you are. Uh, figuratively of course...
I apologize again for calling you an “arrogant little prick”.
And remember, most of us don’t give a rat’s ass if you want to call the cartridge a .45 Auto, hell you could call it a “little Buffalo pecker head” and we’d be fine with it.
B Head is much sound and fury that signifies nothing because no one cares because he is always an ass about it.
Shame too, because he may actually have some knowledge to pass along.
The page I mentioned in post 179 had representations of each of the experimental contenders with the case dimensions and I thought it quite interesting. As noted earlier, along with the Frankford Arsenal round there was the UMC equivalent which was headstamped 45 ACP.
You’re the last batter up so I’ll bore you:<}
As a youngster I recall my grandmother bringing up Douglas MacArthur a couple of times about how her mother and aunts played with him as a kid. He was a bit of a pest of course being a boy and younger than them. My great great grandfather was an Army lifer—1850s to 1880s—and was Arthur MacArthur’s First Sergeant in, I think, Company I of the 13 th Infantry. Thus I have a bit of interest in the equipage of the frontier Army, shootin irons, etc. When my old man was a kid visiting his never wed great aunts in Missouri he found a trunk in the attic with the old boy’s uniforms, sword and Schofield and leather stuff. Whether the pistol was issue or private purchase we don’t know. After the aunts died I do not what happened to the trunk.
Anyway, regarding the 45 “Long” Colt terminology Colt apparently did not officially call the round that HOWEVER it makes sense that appellation came about. There were 32 Short and Long Colt rounds; 38 Short Colt; 41 Short and Long Colts; 450 Colt; 455 Colt revolver rounds and of course the 45 Colt round we are commonly familiar with today.
HOWEVER. HOWEVER. HOWEVER. How many shooters are aware of the 45 Colt also called 45 Government round that was produced for the 45 Schofield revolver? Yessirree folks, there was a 45 Colt cartridge issued by the Army that was the same 1.10” case length as the Schofield round but with the 255 grain bullet and the 45 Colt rim size. I don’t think it was real successful. If anyone ever comes across an old case that is headstamped as above but looks it is too short now you know why. This is why the “unofficial” name of 45 Long Colt came into being.
Epic.
You nailed it.
He’s the guy that makes gun guys look bad and turn possible future gun guys/gals to get discouraged.
In a TSHTF situation the ability to get along with others will count far more than knowing whether its .45 ACP or .45 Auto or even just a 45.
The inability to get along with others will get you thrown out on your butt or maybe even shot.
Interesting. I don't recall running across that one.
Thanks
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/12/jeremy-s/mechtech-c-c-u/
AKA the *.45 S&W* to cavalrymen who could thereby use the same ammunition in eitherthe #3 S&W Schofield in .45 caliber, or in the then-new 1873 Colt Single Action Army, originally issued to the Cavalry with a 7.5" barrel, and later to artillerymen with a 5.5" barrel.
Smith & Wesson was distressed because the government’s money was being directed to their competitor in handgun manufacturing. So with the aid of patents developed by a serving Army officer named Major George Schofield, the Model No. 3 was remodeled. However, the US Government didn’t want the .44 S&W Russian cartridge and Smith & Wesson’s Model No. 3 cylinder lengths were too short for the new .45 Colt with its 1.29-inch case length. So the company developed a brand new .45 cartridge. Case length was shortened to 1.10 inches, bullet weight reduced to 230 grains and powder charge to 28 grains.
Today we call this round the .45 S&W Schofield. Circa 1875 it was referred to as the .45 Government because indeed Smith & Wesson’s Model No. 3 “Schofield†revolvers had been adopted by the US Army as a substitute standard. Early on there was confusion because some cavalry units received S&W Model No. 3 .45 revolvers but their ammunition was the full-size .45 Colt round. Of course it would not chamber in S&W .45 revolvers. So about 1875/1876 the decision was made to cease production of .45 Colt ammunition by government arsenals and only make and issue .45 S&W cartridges. That situation held on well into the 1880s even after all .45 S&W Model No. 3 Schofield revolvers had been withdrawn from government service and sold off as surplus.
As late as the early 1980s, when the military was going through the JSSAP program that eventually gave us the M9 Beretta handgun and M16A2 version of the AR15, there was still .45 S&W Schofield *universal* ammunition in storage in the ammo bunker igloos at NWSC Crane in Indiana. During part of the comparative testing, a couple of thosand rounds was broken out and testfired, in part to determine if the packaging materials [acid-washed brown paper and cotton string] had any long-term ill effects on the cartridges within. Nope. Every round went *bang* as advertised, with great clouds of 30-grain black powder charge smoke, to the amazement of the kids on the range detail who had never seen such a thing from their 9mms.
Very cool, and confusing, history. I had heard of the .45 S&W Schofield round and revolver (I want one).
Merry Christmas!
I hear tell there were some Webleys made in that chambering as well. Kind of interesting.
Still had Schofield rounds in the bunkers? What a hoot shooting them must have been. Knew an old fellow from Iowa who graduated HS circa 1933 who related how his local Guard armory still had Trapdoor Infantry rifles and ammo. They did not shoot them but used them for drilling occasionally.
You just KNOW they sometimes would get sent the wrong pistol ammo at Fort Out-Past-The-Middle-Of-Nowhere so the compromise round makes perfect sense except for the 255 grain bullets. Why not go with the 230s?
Colt sure as hell was not going to put the enemy’s name on their headstamps hence the 45 Colt Govt stamp for the shorter cartridge. Easy to imagine the obvious result though; Buckskin Zeke tells a shopkeeper he wants to replenish his supply for his hogleg. “Zeke, do you want the 45 short Colt or the 45 long Colt?” Since there were already short and long versions of other calibers this would be reasonable wordage.
There’s a gas station in Powers, OR....middle of nowhere, commerce-wise. If they stock the ammo, it’s a good caliber.
In the 1980s our local junior college got its theater rebuilt...and behind one bricked-up interior wall were found the remaining trapdoor Springfield rifles that had been issued to the University's Corps of Cadets when they volunteered for the War in Cuba. They never got there but lost about as many as could have been expected to fall from enemy rounds to Yellow Fever. Their rifles were taken care of though, perfectly greased and packed in greased paper before being racked up in the security of the armory. And then one day, it was bricked up, the masons likely not having the slightest clue about those funny-wrapped lumps against the walls. Sixty-five, seventy years later, they saw daylight again, and now have deserving homes.
That would include Ft Riley, KS and Ft Laramie, Wyoming Territory, among many others, both of which were home to differing Cavalry detachments, including units armed with the old Civil War issue Remington 1858 percussion revolver- also often carried by Indian scouts, the Colt and Schofield, but also sometimes private purchase weapons to include the .442 Webley revolver possibly carried by General Custer during his 1876 demise, and any number of other personal or issued weapons. If the unit's armory didn't have it in stock- and not just for their own weapons, but for any other unit passing through that needed resupply- then the Post Sutler had better have a goodly amount. And after the Civil war, everything from Spencer and Henry repeaters to weapons converted from percussion to cartridge was to be found.
As for why 255-grain pills instead of 230s? Remember that the handgun carried by a cavalryman in those days had as its primary purpose the job of killing a horse, ideally that of an enemy but, sometimes, your own. And in some cases, like those Indian scouts still using paper cartridge Sharps rifles, the revolver bullet could be broken down and its powder charge and bullet could be used in a rifle, assuming a supply of percussion caps was maintained by its user.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.