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To: Ray76
Nope this clears things up for you.

That's a nice side-by-side summary. I had said we weren't establishing a monarchy; that's the biggest point. This adds some paragraph points to the main topic.

Though English history can be a bit more nuanced. King Charles I asserted that "Divine Right of Kings" principle. How'd that turn out for him?

It seems that if the English "version" of natural law and its Divine Right of Kings theory doesn't prevent the people's voice (the Parliament) from opposing the King, taking up arms, arresting him, and executing him -- then I kinda don't think English natural law necessarily precluded the American Colonies' assertion of rights.

But I hope in turn, my citation to Jefferson's Virginia citizen statute made clear that as to municipal law on things like citizenship rules, we very much copied the English rule.

413 posted on 02/06/2015 10:19:12 AM PST by CpnHook
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To: CpnHook; DiogenesLamp
The main points are that the founding principles of the United States recognize the right to abolish government, that ALL are equal - no one is endowed by God to be a god or to rule over others, that all have inalienable rights, and that government derives it's authority from the people.

As DiogenesLamp noted, in England claiming the right to abolish government will result in your execution. See, for example, Algernon Sidney.

Regarding Algernon Sidney:

Thomas Jefferson letter to Mason Locke Weems, December 13, 1804

I thank you for the pamphlet you were so kind as to send me which I have read with great satisfaction. you ask my opinion on the subject of publishing the works of Algernon Sidney. the world has so long and so generally sounded the praises of his Discourses on government, that it seems superfluous, and even presumptuous, for an individual to add his feeble breath to the gale. they are in truth a rich treasure of republican principles, supported by copious & cogent arguments, and adorned with the finest flowers of science. It is probably the best elementary book of the principles of government, as founded in natural right, which has ever been published in any language: and it is much to be desired in such a government as ours that it should be put into the hands of our youth as soon as their minds are sufficiently matured for that branch of study. In publishing it, I think his life, trial & letters should be thrown into one volume & the Discourses into another. the latter is the most important, & many purses can reach one volume which could not conveniently extend to the other. should you proceed to the publication, be so good as to consider me as a subscriber: and accept my salutations & assurances of great esteem & respect.

(emphasis added)

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=mtj1&fileName=mtj1page031.db&recNum=954&itemLink=%2Fammem%2Fcollections%2Fjefferson_papers%2Fmtjser1.html&linkText=6

John Adams letter to Thomas Jefferson, September 18, 1823

With much pleasure I have heard read the sure words of prophecy in your letter of Sep 4th. It is melancholy to contemplate the cruel wars, dessolutions of Countries, and oceans of blood which must occur, before rational principles, and rational systems of Government can prevail and be established - but as these are inevitable we must content ourselves with the consolations which you from sound and sure reasons so clearly suggest These hopes are as well founded as our fears of of the contrary evils, on the whole, the prospect is cheering; I have lately undertaken to read Algernon Sidney on Government. There is a great difference in reading a Book at four and twenty, and at Eighty Eight, as often as I have read it; and fumbled it over; It now excites fresh admiration that this work has excited so little interest in the literary world—as splendid an Edition of it, as the art of printing can produce, as well as for the intrinsic merit of the work, as for the proof it brings of the bitter sufferings of the advocates of Liberty from that time to this and to show the slow progress of Moral philosophical political Illumination in the world ought to be now published in America.

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=mtj1&fileName=mtj1page053.db&recNum=1172&itemLink=/ammem/collections/jefferson_papers/mtjser1.html&linkText=6

418 posted on 02/06/2015 11:51:42 AM PST by Ray76 ("Unlike my mum, Ruth has all the documents needed to prove who Mark's father was.")
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