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To: Muridae
To say quite simply, if you’re going to propose a deity as having created everything, I must ask how you support such a statement; what is your evidence, and how would such an idea be falsified?

Criteria I have no doubt that you will reject off the cuff, but here goes.

Order, complexity, and information.

196 posted on 12/30/2011 2:31:01 PM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

If it makes you feel better, I don’t reject it off the cuff, but I do reject it.

Order is the most interesting of the three you list, but in the words of Carl Sagan,

“There is in this universe much of what appears to be design, but instead we repeatedly discover that natural processes - the collisional selection of worlds, say, or the natural selection of gene pools, or even the convection pattern in a pot of boiling water can extract order out of chaos, and deceive us into deducing purpose where there is none.”

That there is what we can describe as order is not an obvious indication of someone creating the order, as it is apparent that such can arise naturally. You can indeed argue that there is some being who makes sure the laws of the universe runs the way they’re supposed to, but that is unfalsifiable; we really can’t address it in any way - and even if we allow for that assumption, which seems a bit of a stretch, it’s quite a long way to go from that to your specific god, and a very, very long away away from suggesting evolution isn’t correct.

Complexity and information both follow in the same line of reasoning; if you want, I can indeed explain using genetic examples how complexity and what may be considered in a broad sense information can arise via naturalistic processes.

Now, none of what I’ve mentioned disproves most formations and definitions of god - I’m merely pointing out why what you’ve mentioned doesn’t necessarily support the idea.

I imagine you’ve probably had quite enough of me already, and judging by the nature of this sight I’m not expecting you to be interested in my side of things, but if I can trouble you for nine more minutes, I would suggest this short work by Carl Sagan, an excerpt of which I quote above.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8P1Y1a7-L4&feature=related


223 posted on 12/30/2011 4:09:56 PM PST by Muridae
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