A report posted today at a CNN website claims the "mystery missile launch" on Monday was actually a Chinese missile test. According to the report:Posted on 11/12/2010 7:02:24 PM PST by Korah
A report posted today at a CNN website claims the "mystery missile launch" on Monday was actually a Chinese missile test. According to the report:
China flexed its military muscle Monday evening in the skies west of Los Angeles when a Chinese Navy Jin class ballistic missile nuclear submarine, deployed secretly from its underground home base on the south coast of Hainan island, launched an intercontinental ballistic missile from international waters off the southern California coast. WMR’s intelligence sources in Asia, including Japan, say the belief by the military commands in Asia and the intelligence services is that the Chinese decided to demonstrate to the United States its capabilities on the eve of the G-20 Summit in Seoul and the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit in Tokyo, where President Obama is scheduled to attend during his ten-day trip to Asia.
However, the report - placed on CNN's user-generated iReport site - has yet to be vetted or confirmed by CNN, and is full of un-named, unquoted sources. The only link provided goes to a site with basically the same report - again, with no corroboration.
The source of the report is one Wayne Madsen, who once claimed Wikileaks was a CIA operation, and that Al-Qaeda was a front for the military-industrial complex.
No other news organization is reporting the incident as part of a Chinese missile test at this time.
A much less sinister explanation is provided by a site called "Contrail Science".
According to a report at that site, the CBS camera crew probably captured Flight AWE808 from Hawaii to Phoenix, and the perspective of the the viewer made the contrail appear to be a ballistic missile being launched, possibly, from a submarine.
The site reports a very similar incident:
An interesting contrail cropped up off the coast of San Clemente, Orange County, California on December 31st 2009. The curious shape led.......
An aircraft traveling east would be heading directly toward the camera and would eventually fly directly overhead and then off to the east to that horizon. The atmospheric conditions in that area extended to the east slope of the Rockies at that hour. Yet the contrail ends in the western sky far off of the coast.
>>Yet you think the bottom of the plane is reflecting bright light. You contradict yourself there.<<
You’re kidding, right?
The bottom of the plane is reflecting bright light because it is at ~35,000 feet and NOT on the horizon being blocked by haze. It is still in daylight and we get an unobstructed view.It is, and should be, quite bright.
As I said in posts two days ago. I have seen this phenomenon even when there is NO contrail. The plane is just a very bright, usually red or yellow, light. And on rare occasions I’ve seen it at LATE dusk. That is REALLY cool, and really red.
>>Where is the proof that the Helicopter taped contrail drops to the actual physical Horizon ?<<
It’s not necessary. Look at the photo in the original post. There is clearly lots of haze at the bottom. If the sun was behind that same haze, it, too, would be darker. Haze comes in different densities and impacts the sun (and any bright object behind it) at different levels from the horizon. It is clear in the photo in the OP.
Notice in the photo in your post in 183 that the sky around the contrail, all the way down to the hill, is crystal clear. There is nothing to block anything at all, so the contrail loses no brightness.
>>An aircraft traveling east would be heading directly toward the camera and would eventually fly directly overhead and then off to the east to that horizon. The atmospheric conditions in that area extended to the east slope of the Rockies at that hour. Yet the contrail ends in the western sky far off of the coast.<<
I’m really not trying to be obtuse, but I have no idea what you are getting at. If this really IS flight 808, then the contrail would START in the west, near the setting sun (bottom of the picture), go “higher in the sky” as the aircraft traveled east and more “overhead” and then...well, we really don’t know what happened because we have no video showing that.
If only. :)
Look closely at the image I posted. The dark bottom of the contrail goes all the way to the bright spot on the object. The dark bottom of the plume is at the object. Caused by shading, not some haze theory.
As I said in posts two days ago. I have seen this phenomenon even when there is NO contrail.
Fine. Post an image of that specific phenomenon occurring on another plane at altitude. This flight comes by every day, right ?
Not if it were headed away from you as the photographer said he thought it was.
It appears to move slow for a missile because it is moving away at an angle to the northwest, as the photographer said it was, and because it is already very high up by the time the video shows its movement. The angle away from the camera doesn't reveal the distance traveled due to perspective.
We have video of it disappearing from sight.
Yep.
Fine. Proof is not necessary for your assertions, yet our side must have proof for every claim.
Look at the photo in the original post. There is clearly lots of haze at the bottom. If the sun was behind that same haze, it, too, would be darker.
But you would not see the center of the sun darker then its edges. In fact you would see just the opposite. The edges darker then the center. Here is an example.
>>Look closely at the image I posted. The dark bottom of the contrail goes all the way to the bright spot on the object.<<
OK, I re-examined your photo. I noticed a couple of things. First, it is the TOP that is dark, not the bottom. That is because the sun in the background is below the contrail. Second, in that picture at least, there is a gap between the contrail and the bright spot.
It makes it look even MORE like an aircraft contrail.
http://www.svengrahn.pp.se/histind/ASAT/F15ASAT.html
I found something interesting, maybe out of date, but never the less interesting because of the launch direction.
>>But you would not see the center of the sun darker then its edges. In fact you would see just the opposite. The edges darker then the center. Here is an example.<<
That is because the sun is a light SOURCE. The contrail is reflecting and refracting light. The thinner edges let more sunlight through, while the thicker center blocks more light.
Notice that, even where there is no clouds or haze, the contrail is brighter on the edges than in the middle. And, frankly, that could even be an illusion. In some spots it could be not one thick plume with brightness on each edge, but two thin bright plumes with NOTHING between them. I’m not saying it is, I’m saying that cannot necessarily be thrown out for any given centimeter throughout it’s length without very close examination.
Contrails are very tricky. If something looks really weird, it is probably a trick of the air currents and light refraction. I’ve learned that over and over again.
The light and dark pattern in the contrail is clearly even from bottom to top. There is no "gap" between contrail and vehicle in this pic.
Do you require a guide dog to get around?
>>Fine. Proof is not necessary for your assertions, yet our side must have proof for every claim.<<
Proof is not necessary to support the assertion that the sun rises in the east. However, If I wake up and you tell me the sun rose in the west this morning, I’m gonna ask for some proof.
That hits the kernel of this whole thing. The flight 808 explanation along with LOTS of photographic evidence of other contrails - including flight 808 on other days - coupled with a complete absence of corroborating witness accounts of a missile rising from the water in an area with no fewer than 100 boats loitering in the area, makes for what, in a court of law would be an ironclad case for dismissal of the missile theory. Even with the “expert” testimony of those that have viewed the single short videotape.
And I feel compelled to say, again, that at first I also thought it was a missile.
Thanks, I’ll have to examine that tomorrow. I’m running on empty right now.
The top of a contrail at 35,000 feet cannot be seen by a human standing on Earth. And it cannot be seen from a Helicopter at 10,000 feet. Only way it could be seen is if the Helicopter was above the rocket or plane. Is that your assertion ? Don't worry, wont be asking you for proof.
Second, in that picture at least, there is a gap between the contrail and the bright spot.
How many feet would you estimate ?
It was your example. You said you would "see the same thing with the sun seen through haze." Now that it's been burned to the ground it's not a good example?
>>Not if it were headed away from you as the photographer said he thought it was.<<
Yes it would. If this were a missile rising vertically from the water 35 miles away and veering east, you would see it rise rapidly and, as it veered away from you and arced into a less verticle flight path, it would appear to move slower.
But if it was an airplane in level flight coming from the west, as it got closer and closer, it would appear to move faster and faster, reaching it’s maximum perceived speed as it passed through it’s closest point to directly overhead.
>>And that zoom is the kicker for which direction the object is traveling. It’s the behavior of the lens that tells me the moving object much further out than the ‘contrail’.<<
The camera sees only in two dimensions.
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