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To: CE2949BB

I will address your question in full in a future post, so even if you don’t agree with my conclusions, I at least hope you will be satisfied that I have given your question a reasonable response. Because I haven’t read Rand in years, I want to be able to cite specific instances rather than my memory of those instances. In brief, Rand has to make certain assumptions about the nature of reality that are as logically valid as certain assumptions made by the “mystics”. There is a certain amount of faith required in any belief system and one must make a choice in the question of the universals, and while most systems admit this, many “Randians” do not seem to be willing to do so, which is where the problems arise. Again, we’ll get back to this.

As for homosexuality, I don’t see why it has anything to do with belief in a supreme being. You’re right that theocracies are troublesome, but I don’t see people voting their values as being the same as a theocracy. To be honest, I think there is just as much of a possibility of extremist atheists in power killing theists and forcing their own morality (all the while claiming they aren’t doing so) as there is of the opposite situation, so I think a reasonable man can be concerned about the balance tipping too far in either direction.

I read most of Rand’s works, did not find them convincing, and moved on in my search for truth, so simply put, I think I’ve given her a fair shake. I went through a period in life where I examined all possibilities from atheism to mormonism to buddhism to protestantism, etc. I settled on Christianity.

On a side note, I recall you posting images of hot girls, so I’m guessing you’re not gay. :P


470 posted on 12/28/2008 12:52:26 PM PST by NinoFan
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To: NinoFan
I will address your question in full in a future post, so even if you don’t agree with my conclusions, I at least hope you will be satisfied that I have given your question a reasonable response.

I look forward to it. Don't feel rushed.

Because I haven’t read Rand in years, I want to be able to cite specific instances rather than my memory of those instances. In brief, Rand has to make certain assumptions about the nature of reality that are as logically valid as certain assumptions made by the “mystics”.

Rand's axioms.

There is a certain amount of faith required in any belief system and one must make a choice in the question of the universals, and while most systems admit this, many “Randians” do not seem to be willing to do so, which is where the problems arise. Again, we’ll get back to this.

Oh, I look forward to this. :)

As for homosexuality, I don’t see why it has anything to do with belief in a supreme being.

Homosexuality should have nothing to do with a supreme being. However, the holy books of The Big Three condemn homosexuality. True Believers, being God's Holy Warriors on Earth, make sure to enforce God's proclamations.

If a God does exist, it would have to be an 'Einsteinian God'. A cosmic 'God'. Not some petty, little tyrant that gets jealous and punishes his children for all of eternity.

I fail to see how or why God should care where I - or you - stick it. This obsession with the sexual sounds a little too human.

You’re right that theocracies are troublesome,

Once any religion - any belief system that has a supernatural component - gets power, only death and misery can follow.

That's why mysticism in Objectivism would be a Big Deal. For me, at least.

but I don’t see people voting their values as being the same as a theocracy.

If their values - which are based on a supernatural belief system - demand that non-believers be treated differently, then it is a de facto theocracy.

I wouldn't care if 5.9 billion people voted to murder a man. Their votes do not invalidate his right to life.

To be honest, I think there is just as much of a possibility of extremist atheists in power killing theists and forcing their own morality (all the while claiming they aren’t doing so) as there is of the opposite situation, so I think a reasonable man can be concerned about the balance tipping too far in either direction.

As long as the government respects the rights of individuals, it would be difficult to go around murdering people.

I read most of Rand’s works, did not find them convincing, and moved on in my search for truth, so simply put, I think I’ve given her a fair shake. I went through a period in life where I examined all possibilities from atheism to mormonism to buddhism to protestantism, etc. I settled on Christianity.

I recognize the pattern. I was fascinated with Buddhism and Mormonism growing up.

On a side note, I recall you posting images of hot girls, so I’m guessing you’re not gay. :P

Well, I also posted a picture of this guy in a thread about Obama's "sixpack". ;)

However, you're right. Even though I was born and raised in San Francisco, I am straight.

Lonely and straight.

Lonely, desperate, and straight.

473 posted on 12/28/2008 1:42:52 PM PST by CE2949BB (Fight.)
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To: NinoFan
To be honest, I think there is just as much of a possibility of extremist atheists in power killing theists and forcing their own morality (all the while claiming they aren’t doing so) as there is of the opposite situation, so I think a reasonable man can be concerned about the balance tipping too far in either direction.

As is borne out in the atheistic, communist regimes so infamous in the 20th century.

At least the Soviet Union fell.

Sadly, too many countries are still bearing witness of what living under atheistic regimes can lead to.

475 posted on 12/28/2008 2:48:31 PM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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