Why Is Obama Paying Lawyers Instead of Producing Birth Certificate?

yidwithlid ^

[Sibre Fan]

AndyJackson said "The only thing you can rely on are the documents actually filed with the court, all of which you can find at obamacrimes.com"
r9etb replied "LOL -- speaking from personal experience, I'm not even sure about that.... I'm peripherally involved with a lawsuit in which one side has committed actual perjury with their filings; not once, but many times.

I think you're both right. The only thing you can rely on to determine Berg's actual claims are his papers. Not his press releases, not his public interviews, but what he says in his papers. R9etb is right, though, that just because something is alleged in a court filing does not mean that it is true. (Such as the "Canadian Birth Certificate claim in Berg's first complaint, or his Illinois Bar claim that he's still making even after Jeff Schreiber proved that one wrong.)

moopie1 said "Obama’s Certificate of Citizenship that he received when he returned from Indonesia, as if it exists it would indicate that Obama was “naturalized”
I think Peerless already dealt with this, but...
1. This statement assumes that a Certificate of Citizenship exists.
2. This assumption, that a Certificate of Citizenship exists, assumes that one was needed.
3. This assumption, that a Certificate of Citizenship was needed, assumes that Berg has read the law correctly.
As Peerless pointed out, Did Obama Become an Indonesian Citizen when His Mother, Ann Durham, married Lolo Soetoro, and moved to Indonesia?, and the law cited/sourced there, indicates that Berg's reading is wrong. There are other posts at That site that indicates Berg's reading of the law on multiple issues is wrong.

I don't know if Peerless is a Commie or a DNC operative or an Anarchist, but I think he's been pretty "spot-on" in his analysis of Berg's claims. I understand that the author of the Whats Your Evidence site is an Obama supporter, per Polarik.

And ..... If we are going to discount a person because of his politics, we'd have to discount everything that this 9/11 Truther Berg says too. I just don't understand that "mental whiplash" sort of thinking.

rightwingextremist1776 said "What is absolutely amazing about this is he wouldn’t qualify for a drivers license without one!"

Very good point. We know that Obama had his drivers' license at least by the time he went to Harvard -- and failed to pay a dozen (or more?) parking tickets while there. We know that he's driven since, and so it's a safe assumption that he got a license in Illinois. How did he get that? Doesn't it seem more likely than not that he had the required documentation, or wouldn’t have been able to get a license?

Can we go back to focusing on things that matter yet?

[Polarik]

Why in the hell is it OK for FactCheck to get its hands on a copy of Obama's CoLB but NOT OK for an actual Court of Law to obtain a certified copy of the long form...??? Well....?

Excellent point, and one I also raised in reference to the real COLB that Michele sent me, "If a total stranger can do it, then why not Obama?"

FactCheck is Annenberg. Annenberg is linked to Obama and Ayers.

I'm not sure who's COLB Factcheck got its "hands" on, but my money is on FactCheck and Annenberg being the souce of all the forgeries, both scanned and photographed..

It should be no surprise that the offices of Annenberg were used for their phony photo shoot, so why not the scan as well.

Yep. FactCheck has both the means, the opportunity, and the motive for manufacturing Obama's COLB from someone else's scanned original.

I've said that FactCheck most likely made the other two copies of it and sent them to the Kos and FTS, respectively. In fact, I'd bet that they sent the Kos a copy that was already cropped, with Certificate Number redacted, and with a moderate increase in JPG compression, just so that they could release the "original scan" (just a less compressed version) when the time came for it.

Sure enough, that's exactly what they did. That's the reason why the same Exif data is in both copies.

Then they basically waited to see what sorts of responses they would receive on the Kos and FTS websites. However, they did't wait for long because they issued their "higher res" forgery copy on June 16.

What I'd like to know, for sure, is why they decided to do the photo shoot in mid-August after everyone else's research had been discredited.

I mean, I can make a compelling case for myself being the thorn in their side that prompted it because I kept pressing the issue, keeping it alive when they thought that they were in the clear, and that it had rolled over and died.

But, in reality, FactCheck, like so many of their dishonest breed, do really stupid things thinking that nobody is going to question them.

It's what they say that gave them away.

[AndyJackson]

We know that Obama had his drivers' license at least by the time he went to Harvard -- and failed to pay a dozen (or more?) parking tickets while there.

Which reemphasizes the question, who did pay for his time at Harvard. Keeping a car in Cambridge is expensive and a major hassle. You wouldn't do it if you were living off of scholarships, loans and income from part time jobs.

[Peerless]

Peerless, I also think you are a DNC plant. Or an Obama Plant. Either way, the information you present is correct. Hopefully you will post on some other target so I can thoroughly trounce you for your support of a Marxist Socialist.

I'm afraid you'll be waiting around an awwwwwwwful long time for that.

I have no party affiliation, and don't work for Obama or the DNC. If I were to put any sort of label on my politics, it would be libertarian. And neither Obama nor McCain will be getting my vote in November.

[Peerless]

There are problems with the photos as Polarik has stated in previous posts.

No, there aren't. But I've spent enough time with Polarik's nonsense so I'll just leave it at that.

Here's the 64,000 dollar question that the Obama apologists on this thread simply cannot answer :

Why in the hell is it OK for FactCheck to get its hands on a copy of Obama's CoLB but NOT OK for an actual Court of Law to obtain a certified copy of the long form...???

Here's a better question. Why didn't Berg simply pay a visit Obama's campaign headquarters in Chicago and ask to see the actual paper document? Even the folks at FactCheck had to put in at least that much effort.

[DouglasKC]

Well you're certainly a one issue poster since you signed up on October 1. I do think you're a plant and if this is all smoke and no fire than I doubt that Obama would have to defend this issue. It's an issue exactly because it hasn't been clearly proven that Obama is qualified. Labeling everything that points to Obama NOT being born in Hawaii as myth is fine but not exactly proof. But of course opinions mean nothing and the central point still remains: Why is Obama spending money on lawyers instead of just providing what's asked for?

My own pet theory is that the leftists want to either create a constitutional crisis or a civil war by getting someone elected who's not qualified. If he's elected then they're going to dare anyone to challenge it. If he truly isn't constitutionally eligible to be President it's not going to be pretty.

[Peerless]

No. What Berg is saying, and why he ammended his suit, is that the DNC has perpetrated a fraud upon registered Democrats

That's incorrect. Berg made that claim in his original filing.

These are criminal fraud charges against Obama and the DNC.

Berg cannot levy any criminal fraud charges against Obama or the DNC. This is a civil suit. Any criminal charges would have to come from the US Justice Department.

[Peerless]

It should be no surprise that the offices of Annenberg were used for their phony photo shoot, so why not the scan as well.

And it should REALLY be no surprise that as usual you're absolutely incorrect.

The photos were taken at Obama's campaign headquarters in Chicago. Not at Annenberg.

Here's a Chicago Sun Times article about Obama's new (at the time) headquarters:

Obama's new HQ has room to move

If you click on the image with "PHOTO GALLERY" above it, you'll find among the photos, this one, in which you can see the carpet pattern:

And here is photograph 3 from FactCheck's website. The gamma has been adjusted to bring out details from the very dark background of the original image.

As you can see, the carpeting is the same as that in Obama's campaign headquarters in Chicago.

Polarik's been trying to feed people similar nonsense for months, and sadly most people don't have the wherewithal to know any better.

I said previously that I'd wasted enough time on his nonsense, but since he decided to post in this thread and try feeding you even more nonsense, I thought I'd just give a quick example of how easy it is to shoot down this sh... stuff.

[Peerless]

Ooops. Sorry. The link to diyAudio.com didn't work like I hoped it would.

What you can do is just go to www.diyaudio.com, click on "Search," enter "Steve Eddy" in "Search by User Name," and set Search Options for "Show results as posts."

[Peerless]

Oops number two. Just noticed I transposed the last two numbers of the phone number.

It's 916 457-7946.

Sorry.

[Cyropaedia]

You're wrong. Polarik has done a solid job of pointing out discrepancies involved with the Kos and FTS CoLB's. There are discrepancies with the FactCheck CoLB as well. Their refusal to post full page, flatbed scans of the CoLB is simply ludicrous.

I'll make this simple. When doubts surrounding a Presidential candidate's qualifications regarding his birthright citizenship and birth records reach a point where he actually has to put own his own sites on the web to specifically deal with these questions, and he has to actually fight efforts to produce his birth certificate in court, well, then it is well past time to allow outside parties to obtain their own copies of that candidate's birth certificate. In other states, media entities would have been able to obtain their own certified copies of a candidate's birth certificate directly from the Registrar's office.

So what Obama should have done was allow various media entities to obtain their own certified copies of his CoLB directly through Hawaii's Department of Health. NBC News, Fox News, the WSJ, IBD, the Washington Times , the Washington Post, the New York Post and the New York Times should been able to obtain their own certified copies from the DoH, and then they all could have posted their own scans on their official websites. Such an approach wouldn't have cost the Obama campaign a dime, seeing how each of these organizations could have paid the processing fees for the certificates themselves.

By this stage of the game, there is simply no point in failing to produce the document that Berg is requesting. Obama could do this in a hearbeat, he simply refuses to do so. Such an approach only serves to fuel the doubts and suspicions of the very people you are attempting to win over. It is a waste of Obama's time and money. The same holds true for the taxpayers. It is simply the most counter-productive approach he can take. He should have produced the documents for the court and nipped this thing in the bud.

He produced a document for FactCheck, he can certainly produced a copy of the long form for the Court. The was never any reason not to do so.

[Peerless]

You're wrong. Polarik has done a solid job of pointing out discrepancies involved with the Kos and FTS CoLB's.

Yeah, his claim that the FactCheck photos were taken at Annenberg's offices, rather than Obama's Chicago campaign headquarters was real solid.

He's just another Techdude.

But hey, believe whatever you want to believe.

[yldstrk]

do they even have birth certificates in Kenya??

[yldstrk]

The hospital he claims to have been born in wasn’t built yet...................

[Shady Ray]

“Is this the same RNC opposition research team that Larry Johnson of NoQuarter reported had gone to Hawaii and acquired Obama’s original Hawaiian birth certificate and that it was in the name of Barry Soetoro?”

Never heard of that team...sounds like a dangerous mission though. /s

[Shady Ray]

“So which birth certificate are they going to drop on him? The one from Hawaii or the one from Kenya?”

My money is on Kenya... “former US President Bill Clinton identified Kibaki as the one living person he would most like to meet ‘because of the Kenyan government’s decision to abolish school fees for primary education.’”

Billy Jeff can have his inside contacts in Kenya make one up from scratch if needed. Obama better be careful... if he leaves holes in his personal story, the Clintonistas will be more than happy to fill them in for him using their own artistic license :-)

[Peerless]

Never heard of that team...sounds like a dangerous mission though. /s

Yeah. Might end up being garroted with a lei.

[Cyropaedia]

It isn't the location that the photographs were taken in that is the bone of contention; it's the attributes and characteristics within the document and its typeface.

That strawman argument won't work.

[Peerless]

It isn't the location that the photographs were taken in that is the bone of contention; it's the attributes and characteristics within the document and its typeface.

The attributes and characteristics within the document and its typeface are all consistent with those of a certification of live birth issued by the Hawaiian Department of Health.

That strawman argument won't work.

As I said, I just gave it as a quick and simple example of how Polarik likes to "invent" stuff. And also as I said, over the previous several months I'd already addressed the fabrications offered up by Techdude and Polarik and don't care to waste any more time on irrelevant issues.