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To: mrjesse
Let us get to the point, is it 'breeding' if you mate a horse and an ass? Is it 'breeding" if you mate the offspring of a horse and an ass? What is your definition of 'kind' as regards to your definition of species?

Again, here you are accusing me of being a liar. If you can so easily prove it, please do so!

I am merely upping the anti. How certain are you of your convictions? The fact that you refuse to accept the terms are very telling. Honest people that I know are very willing to stand behind what they say. Why aren't you? If you are certain enough that you are correct to call me a liar, why aren't you certain enough to put your beliefs on the line?

Are you on any medications that are reasonably likely to be interfering with your thinking capabilities? I can't imaging why else you'd have such a hard time understanding stuff.

Your problem is that you are incapable of seeing beyond anything your Minister or Bible tells you. All you can do is parrot back what you have been taught and are incapable of thinking for yourself.

I will tell you a truth. You can think for yourself, you can challenge authority, just because an 'expert' says something doesn't mean it is true. Be a skeptic, the skeptic is always closer to the truth than a believer.

84 posted on 08/16/2008 2:12:14 PM PDT by LeGrande
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To: LeGrande
Let us get to the point, is it 'breeding' if you mate a horse and an ass? Is it 'breeding" if you mate the offspring of a horse and an ass? What is your definition of 'kind' as regards to your definition of species?

I refer you to the dictionary again. This time check out the Synonyms and Related Words, specifically:
Verb	1.	breed - call forth
engender, spawn
cause, do, make - give rise to; cause to happen or occur, not always intentionally; "cause a commotion"; "make a stir"; "cause an accident"
AND
4.	breed - have young (animals) or reproduce (organisms); "pandas rarely breed in captivity"; "These bacteria reproduce"
multiply
procreate, reproduce, multiply - have offspring or produce more individuals of a given animal or plant; "The Bible tells people to procreate"
pullulate - breed freely and abundantly
Don't you see the explicit implication of causation for the word "breed?" That's why we have sayings like "Familiarity breeds contempt" - you may be able to get things to mate till the cows come home, but if you can't get offspring, then they didn't breed - because nothing was produced!

So to answer your question, according to the dictionary definition breeding creates offspring, horses and donkeys can (and do) breed and produce offspring, even though the offspring is generally infertile. You can read more about mules on WP so I will be brief here, but basically (and I'm generalizing, read WP for details) a horse and a donkey produce a mule. Mules are almost always infertile, although there have been a few dozen record cases of mare mules producing offspring, usually with a horse sire, usually giving a 100% horse offspring.

So yes, horses and donkeys interbreed to give mules, but mules usually (even though they may mate happily) will not breed - that is to say they usually will not conceive.

I am merely upping the anti. How certain are you of your convictions?

As I said, I am not aware of you answering the 102 degree question that I asked, but maybe you did and I just missed it. You say you did. All I'm asking is for you to show me where you answered it! Why does there need to be an anti? And why would I promise to do something absurd just because you show me where you answered my question? I've missed things when reading stuff before - I wouldn't stake my life on me having noticed every single statement you ever made to me, although I do try hard to do it. Your request is absurd and clearly indicates that you did indeed not answer my question!

The fact that you refuse to accept the terms are very telling.

No, it's telling that your terms are absurd. And the absurdity of your terms is very telling that you did not answer - otherwise you could just show me where!

Your terms really sound like a 2 year old's!

Imagine this:

Dad says: Jimmy, where did you leave the broom.
Jimmy says: I already told you where.
Dad: When was that? Tell me again.
Jimmy: Sign over the house and the car to me and I'll tell you.

See? Totally absurd! Did Jimmy really think he was going to get the car and the house just like that? No, but he knew his dad wouldn't do that and figured if his dad buys into this 2-year-old-logic, then his dad won't make him answer the question, and thereby Jimmy gets away with lying. But it's not honest fair logic!

Honest people that I know are very willing to stand behind what they say. Why aren't you?

I have stood behind what I've said! (except where I made an error, in which case I posted a correction and an apology as soon as I found out.) I'm the one that's saying "Show me where I lied! Show me that I'm wrong!" I have re-stated the same things over and over! You're the one that won't stand behind what you say (Unless it's unverifiable!) -- you won't even tell me ONE case where I lied nor will you tell me where you answered my pluto/102 degree question. (specifically the one that I asked.)

If you are certain enough that you are correct to call me a liar, why aren't you certain enough to put your beliefs on the line?

Where did I say that you did lie without demonstrating that you did lie?

And why would I want to put my beliefs on the line for someone who hasn't the decency to point out where he answered a question? As I said before, maybe you did answer and I just didn't see it. That is no wrong on my part - and it's no reason to put my beliefs about other things on the line. Let us not forget that I asked you to answer the question many times before you began claiming that you had answered it. So I know that you were reluctant to answer it in the first place, so I have all the more reason to suspect that you didn't answer it if I can't find the answer.

And you keep refusing to answer my question about whether you be on any medications which are likely to affect your thinking.

-Jesse
88 posted on 08/16/2008 3:55:36 PM PDT by mrjesse (Could it be true? Imagine, being forgiven, and having a cause, greater then yourself, to live for!)
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