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To: hchutch
Thank you for exposing what your really seem to think about some of these people.

You prove just what I have suspected about the paleos all along. They seem to think some folks can't handle freedom due to an accident of birth that has them living in Tehran as opposed to New York.

On the other hand, neo-conservatives happen to have the strange notion that Thomas Jefferson meant what he wrote when he said "all men are created equal" and had inalienable rights to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" - rights that came from God, not any government.

You grossly underestimate those people. Take a look at Eastern Europe and Japan if you want to see how wrong you are about how well people can handle freedom.

And thank you for demonstrating the complete and utter ignorance neocons have when it comes to history. First of all, the ability people have to "handle freedom" depends much on the culture in which they were raised. I'm sure you've heard the example of a captive animal being set free only to end up walking around in an area the size of the cage it once inhabited.

Secondly, Thomas Jeferson not only talked about inalienable rights, but he also warned against the dangers of big government. If you leave the goal of shrinking government out of the equation (which is exactly what neocons do, since winning elections is their main objective), then it makes no difference who's in charge--the end result is the same.

Thirdly, you cannot compare apples to oranges. The success of democratic principles in countries like Japan cannot be compared to countries like Iraq. As for Eastern Europe, I wouldn't list that as a shining example of the triumph of liberty. Remember the caged animal? Most of those nations are very close to reverting back to communism.

97 posted on 05/12/2003 8:08:53 AM PDT by sheltonmac
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To: sheltonmac
Ignorance of history?

If thoughts like your last post makes you feel better about what is, at best, stupidity, go ahead and think them. Go ahead and continue to whine. But the paleos are being seen for what they are, and they are rightly being rejected.

That must be why Sobran and others reacted so harshly to David Frum's article. The truth hit hard, and it hurt pretty bad, didn't it?
99 posted on 05/12/2003 8:23:33 AM PDT by hchutch (America came, America saw, America liberated; as for those who hate us, Oderint dum Metuant)
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To: sheltonmac
And thank you for demonstrating the complete and utter ignorance neocons have when it comes to history. First of all, the ability people have to "handle freedom" depends much on the culture in which they were raised. I'm sure you've heard the example of a captive animal being set free only to end up walking around in an area the size of the cage it once inhabited.

Secondly, Thomas Jeferson not only talked about inalienable rights, but he also warned against the dangers of big government. If you leave the goal of shrinking government out of the equation (which is exactly what neocons do, since winning elections is their main objective), then it makes no difference who's in charge--the end result is the same.

Thirdly, you cannot compare apples to oranges. The success of democratic principles in countries like Japan cannot be compared to countries like Iraq. As for Eastern Europe, I wouldn't list that as a shining example of the triumph of liberty. Remember the caged animal? Most of those nations are very close to reverting back to communism.

Great post. Bump.

146 posted on 05/12/2003 10:25:27 AM PDT by Under the Radar (Women's lib gave women the ability to pick up the check for their own abortions.)
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