Was Lott Right? Let's Debate

[TheBattman]

Opening up a can of worms that I have already been warned that Jim Rob does not tolerate.....good luck!

[billorites]

Race has been this country's Achille's Heal for over two-hundred years.

Truman dragged the country, kicking and screaming, into integration. Thurmond wouldn't have integrated the military.

Lott's out of his mind.

[A Vast RightWing Conspirator]

Too bad. What's the worth of a discussion forum if discussion is not tolerated?

[Oldeconomybuyer]

Bravo!

[Senator Goldwater]

Thurmond's election in 1948 wouldn't have advanced Jim Crow, if that's what the media is implying.

The larger question about 1948 to mymind is how Thurmond or Dewey would've dealt with the Marshall Plan, Red China, Korea, the Russian H-bomb and Tail Gunner Joe McCarthy, as those were the defining moments of the last Truman term.

On those scores, Thurman has shown himself to be a staunch anti-communist and defender of liberty. Brown vs Board of Education would've still happened, and perhaps a Thurmond presidency might've expedited it.

Lott's verbal clumsiness at least has given the country a chance at some serious historical re-examination.

[steve-b]

Okay, so…let’s begin to talk about racial integration which is supposed to be the opposite of racial segregation.

Sorry. The issue in 1948 was not government-enforced integration, but rather the removal of government-enforced segregation. The two are not equivalent, and it is either laziness or dishonesty to pretend that they are.

[Hemingway's Ghost]

The issue in 1948 was not government-enforced integration, but rather the removal of government-enforced segregation.

We have a winner. There goes your whole thread, AVRWC.

[Hatteras]

"Was Lott correct in stating that integration created problems that could have been avoided?"

Is there a quote directly attributed to Trent Lott where he makes the statement that "integration created problems that could have been avoided"? Or is this just an assumption based on press reports and speculation as to what's going on in the dark, cobwebbed recesses of his tired, old brain?

[Ispy4u]

I propose that Lott was right. Although not in the context that almost everyone seems to have taken his comments.

I belive that Lott was more referring to Truman's expanding the New Deal social programs and the (in 1948) policies of extending american aid to anyone who opposed communists getting aid (I belive this was placed in context with our Vietnam debacle more than actually opposing the Soviet Union).

I belive these things because Lott was 7 years old when this election occurred and didn't start his political career until 1968 (Nationally in 1972). Basically he was speaking of something he had no real experience with and I'm certain that no one told him that when Thrumond ran for president his platform was segregation (I don't even know if it was his platform, I'm only assuming that from the ongoing discussions).

My 2 cents.

[Catspaw]

Oh, sure. I want to see your views on "separate but equal," interracial marriage, poll taxes and blacks having the right to vote. It's your thread--you go first.

[Catspaw]

Why don't you get the conversational ball rolling. Let's see your views on separate but equal, interracial marriage, blacks having the right to vote and poll taxes.

[xkaydet65]

Who you invite into your home or to socialize with is your business, but when predjudice and YES racism extends to the business of everyday life it must be controlled. That is the job of Gevernment. Racially separated schools in the South were never and would never be equal. Job opporunites for African Americans would have been limited, especially in the South, to the lowest rung on the ladder.

Remember that Thurmond was not just for stopping integration he walked out of the convention because it had passed a civil rights plank in the platform calling for the integration of those places open to the public. I don't think we whites can ever comprehend the fact of being black into the 1960's. My cousin who was Deputy Provost Marshal of Pope Air Base in Fayetteville N.C. tells the story of how he and his friend, a black 2nd Lt from Chi. could not travel off post together.Could not even get a burger and a shake in the local soda fountain. My cousin would never have won any NAACP awards, but this kid from Astoria NYC was bewildered how a man who had sworn to defend his nation , even at the cost of his life, could not get counter service in a soda fountain in Fayetteville NC in 1961. That's the America Strom Thurmond ran for president to preserve.Maybe he changed, as some have claimed, but it's clear from his statements that Trent Lott thinks, even today, that Strom Thurmond's dream was right for America.

Remember when they give you the right to discriminate against one group you're giving anyone the right to discriminate against you. That's why Thurmond's America was and is wrong, and why those who defend it have to be reminded to look past color and race and gender. Trent Lott needs a reminder and losing his leadership post would be a powerful lesson.

[G.Mason]

"I see no reasons why any and all of this topics not be calmly and thoroughly discussed at a forum such as FR’s."

You were on a roll until the last line.

Not on F.R.

I remember Lyndon Baines Johnson and the advent of low income "high rise" tenements that were built in Newark, New Jersey and accross this land.

The squalor that followed, and the exodus of the people.

Could it have been different?

Sure it could.

However it won't be discussed here, with any logic.

FWIW? Good post.

[Hunble]

What do people have to say and what do they do in their private lives? – While it is true that there is a minority of ‘color blind’ people, and I happen to be one, most seem to feel comfortable and to want to be with ‘their kind’, whenever possible. The majority of people date and marry within their own race or ethnicity. People segregate themselves in their neighborhoods, social clubs and restaurants, schools, even professions and occupations.

Good points and they should be expressed.

Our laws should be 'color blind' and apply to every U.S. citizen equally, and no race should be given preferential treatment by the government over others.

Unfortunately, the government has violated this basic principle in many ways, in a misguided notion of forcing people into associations which are in conflict with basic human nature. Instead of diffusing the racial tensions in America, in many ways, these policies have aggravated them.

We Republicans must continue to strive for true equality for all citizens and strongly attack any form of discrimination.

[conservativemusician]

You make some interesting points. But, Lott never mentioned integration specifically as the cause of the "problems" we have had. While the Dixiecrat party had an anti-integration platform, it was the Jim Crow laws that were the real problem.

You cannot FORCIBLY integrate schools, communities, and businesses and expect good results. PEOPLE should be FREE to live where they want, go to school in the neighborhood where they live, and seek employment in their chosen field without restriction. Hiring should be based on the merits of the potential employee.

I am against discrimination OR preference of ANY kind.I believe it is the preferences that cause problems, not anti-discrimination legislation.

[Lee'sGhost]

"We have a winner. There goes your whole thread, AVRWC. "

As well it should. This is someone who is either hopelessly racist or lib agitator who thinks he's going to get Freepers to show their "true" colors. Either way he's wrong.

[G.Mason]

"Oh, sure. I want to see your views on "separate but equal," interracial marriage, poll taxes and blacks having the right to vote. It's your thread--you go first."

May I?

What ghetto do you live, and raise your family in?

[Oldeconomybuyer]

...Sorry. The issue in 1948 was not government-enforced integration...

I think the point the Lott attackers are trying to make is that the Senator is a racist today - which I think is horsehockey. VRWC is trying to start a dialogue on the merits of segregation and the "Great Society" in general, which I think is a worthy debate topic based on the many issues confronting the group these programs were designed to help.

Once you get past the usual race-baiters like Sharpton, Jackson, and the Congressional Black Cacus the remaining attackers are folks like me who think he's a bad Majority Leader-elect.

[Bikers4Bush]

Forced integration doesn't work, period. The busing failure in the Cleveland schools was a prime example.

People want to live around people that are like minded, race for the most part isn't the determining factor of who you will or won't tolerate having as a neighbor.

If you want the races to live around one another it's the cultures that have to be changed not the colors.