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To: Junior
Worth is whatever you assign it. Gold is intrinsically worthless; it is only man's desire for it that gives it value.

We aren't talking about gold. However, it does not surprise me that an atheist would equate humans with an inanimate object. I will go further and state that your arguments are worthless and without meaning and value because even your thoughts are the result of meaningless, random, impersonal, material processes. So, why should I listen to you? I have my own random impersonal material mental processes. Thus, no one person's thoughts can possibly be superior to another's. All you can do is keep repeating your same mantra - "value is subjective" because logically you lose every time.

3,376 posted on 01/07/2003 7:32:37 AM PST by exmarine
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To: exmarine
I'm not an atheist. I'm Catholic. I am a rationalist, though and I like working from first principles. Unfortunately, I cannot agree with you that worth is objective. Even is worth is measured in God's eyes, it is still subjective as it is God determining the worth of the individual. Worth is not universal, as we consider people closer to us to be more worthwhile than complete strangers. I would find it difficult to make an argument that worth could be objective as it is a value judgement and not a physical property.
3,380 posted on 01/07/2003 7:42:05 AM PST by Junior
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To: exmarine
I will go further and state that your arguments are worthless and without meaning and value because even your thoughts are the result of meaningless, random, impersonal, material processes. 

But my thoughts are not random, and you perceive meaning in them.  They may be worthless (and some would consider them to be); however, you have assigned enough value to them to answer them.

So, why should I listen to you?

That's your prerogative.

I have my own random impersonal material mental processes. 

But your communications of those thoughts (and by extension the thoughts themselves) are not random or impersonal.  You seem to think that if God is not controlling your thoughts then your thoughts 

Thus, no one person's thoughts can possibly be superior to another's. 

It all depends upon what value you assign a particular individual's opinion.

All you can do is keep repeating your same mantra - "value is subjective" because logically you lose every time.

If value is objective, it should be a measurable property of an object.  All measurements of value so far proffered have so far been subjective.  Logically, I consider this position unassailable. 

3,400 posted on 01/07/2003 8:37:38 AM PST by Junior (The Catholic Rationalist)
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